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Topic Subject: Ultimate German Rush
posted 10-30-05 11:59 PM EDT (US)   
This is the rush I have developed over the past couple of days and it has been extremely effective. Best of all, I have playtested it through homecity level 10 without choosing any new cards, so it can be done effectively on any level.

There is alot of micro that has to be done in the Discovery Age to make this more effective in the Colonial Age, especially if your opponent is any good and repels the rush before you get the TC down or do significant damage. Do not attempt this against the Ottomans unless you know what you are doing (they can hit you hard at home with a Jan rush before you get a chance to disrupt their econ with Uhlans) and be wary of doing it on the French (their vills higher HP makes it hard to take enough of them down with your Uhlans...and if they rush you it's probably over). I'm not going to go through all of the micro I do, but once you get it down, you will be able to flawlessly execute this strategy on any map besides Amazonia or Caribbean time and time again.

GeneralVasa's U.(hlan)R.(aid)/I.(nfantry)R.(ush)

1. First vills and settler wagon onto unpacking food crates. If your herdables are near enough to the TC, send one vill to a spot just a little behind them and shoot one to force the rest to run near the TC. As soon as you have 100 food, hit T and then V to queue up a vill in your TC.

As soon as you have 100 wood, send one vill to build a house, hold shift and then click on the house and then click on the deer you killed with the other vill. This will automatically send your vill to the deer. Once the crates are unpacked, send the rest of the vills to the deer that was killed, and kill another one next to the TC.

Put your TC gather point on the second dead deer. At some point in the middle of all of this, you should hit the / key and set waypoints in a circle around your immediate vicinity for your explorer. Finding either an experience treasure or a killing a few weak guardians is very helpful. All of this should be done before the first vill comes out of the TC.

(Note: If your herdables were not near the TC, and you had to send one vill to push them towards it, you will want to send your other vills and settler wagon and also set your TC rally point on berries. The quicker you can get them off of berries and on to a deer that has been pushed to the TC the better. Noobs might want to not use this strategy on maps where there are no really close huntables until they are proficient with hunting deer.)

2. Everytime you get 100 food, hit T and V to queue another vill. As soon as you've killed 2 or so enemies (getting your explorer killed will ruin the entire strategy) send him with waypoints in a line on the very end of the map from you, starting with the spot you think the enemy's TC is in.

3. By the time you can queue up to 13 or 14 pop limit, you should have a home shipment ready. Timing is crucial, so AS SOON as you hear the little bell hit the H key to go to your shipment page, and then select the 300 food crate.

4. Select the 4 closest vills to the TC and set them to a control group. Set the rest of the vills to a different control group. It works best if your micro game is good and you can keep your deer close to the TC. If your micro game sucks, every once in a while take a vil out past the deer herd and shoot them. This will cause them to run closer to the TC. Wait about 10 seconds and shoot them agin.

5. If you've done everything right so far, you should have 500 food just immediately before the food crate ships in. Hit the second control group button and send all of those vills to the nearest wood source.

6. I keep a look out for my explorer at all times, and when I find the TC I set waypoints in a circle around it so I can see where the enemy has their vills. Try to find an unprotected gold pit or some hunters far from the TC...and remember where they are.

7. When the crate arrives, hit the 1st control group and have them unpack the food. If you've done everything right, this will occur right before or right as the last vill is produced. Set the TC gather point to the nearest wood. As soon as you have the 800 food, hit the advance button (select the free 500 food). Task the 4 villagers to gathering food, and take one of the woodies and send them towards the enemy TC, which you should have found by now. About one screen outside of your town have them build a house, and set them to a control group. As soon as the house is built, recall them and send them towards the TC again...this time building a house right on the edge of where you can build one because of the enemy TC restriction.

8. As you advance, you should watch your food. As soon as you can queue up two villagers, send your 4 food vills to wood. You will need the extra boost to build the barracks.

9. You should get a home shipment sometime before you advance. AS SOON as you advance, hit the H key and select the 5 uhlans. Also, take the 4 food vills from earlier and have them unpack the 500 food crate. Queue up vills to wood for all of your food but 200 or so. Make sure to shift click on the crate and then shift click on a herdable to they dont go idle. Also, recall your house building vill and have them build a barracks as soon as you go colonial.

Now, depending on the situation you will either continue pumping out wood vills and adding a food vill here and there to make crossbows, or adding more food vills to make pikemen. You won't need any gold unless the game advances past mid-colonial, which is unlikely if you are playing a game in the Home City 1-8 level.

10. When the uhlans pop out, set them to contol group one and send them to whatever unprotected vills you found earlier. If you've done everything right, you should have advanced way before most civs except maybe the Ottomans. Your Uhlans will slaughter the unprotected vills, and if you can micro well and kill enough of them, it might win you the game right there.

You want to hit FOOD and GOLD especially. Without food, their economy will falter because they can't produce vills or units. Without gold, they can't effectively counter attack massed crossbows, except to turtle with outposts which wastes vill time and lots of wood.

11. By the time the Uhlans pop out, your barracks will be up. Queue up 5 pikemen and send them towards an enemy house that is far from the TC or some other vills that are far from the TC. If you can hit them hard before they hit Colonial, start queuing up pikemen and attack their TC once you have about 15 or 20, all the while constantly raiding with you Uhlans.

12. After this it's mostly up to you. I try to shift some wood vills to gold at about 8:00 if I don't win outright with the first rush, so I can pump out some Uhlans to seriously raid the economy. It depends on your situation though, and what the enemy is using. You also might want to add a market during a lull in the fighting to get the wood and hunting upgrades. Done correctly this can give you a 4:00 minute Colonial time, with enough incoming resources to field a 30 unit army by 5:30.


I won a 2v2 game where my teammate had dropped before the game started in 7 minutes using this. Both hit colonial about 5:30, but by this time I had almost taken down the first one's TC with pikes and quickly mopped up the second one's army with crossbows and destroyed his TC.

Optional Cards

I haven't tested it, but I am reasonably certain you can get 1 settler wagon instead of the 300 food and still pull off this strat with the same Colonial time. It all depends on how early you can get your first shipment. In Carolinas you could probably do it with 11 vills instead of the normal 12. (Which gives you a 15 vill pop on Carolina and 16 vill pop elsewhere, strengthening your economy during the upgrade to Colonial).

Also, a furrier card will work if you can get it really early (I've only done it on a map where an experience treasure guarded by 3 wolves was right next to my initial TC), and would allow you to rush with a 13 pop instead of 14. This would give you a weaker rush, but you could get Uhlans earlier and do some serious raiding damage to any economy.


Leader- OOYA (Odhinn Owns Ye All)

Also check out my band at www.myspace.com/wdreams

[This message has been edited by lordvasa (edited 10-31-2005 @ 00:39 AM).]

Replies:
posted 11-01-05 06:57 AM EDT (US)     1 / 20  
never go the recource cards, definatly get furrier
posted 11-01-05 08:10 AM EDT (US)     2 / 20  
I used to do this rush. I found it is better if you put down a native american trade post instead of a barracks first. You won't believe how effective this is. These guys can come out faster early in the game (because you aren't slowed down by houses) and they can move almost fast enough to keep up with your horses (Barracks units are sloooow).

Keep getting Uhlans with shipments, but my advice would be to not build another millitary building until you have maxxed out your native population. Besides, by then you will know exactly which building to build and you won't have to guess.

This usually works so well it makes me feel guilty.

Also, for Germans, once you hit level 10 and on, it is better to get 2 settler wagons in age 1 then Furrier. Furrier is only a  bonus to hunting. That means that it is about 1 extra citizen for every 7 on food. 2 Settler Wagons is like 4 extra citizens. Therefore, Furrier is not better until you have about 28 guys on food, and that isn't going to happen for a long time. You aren't worried about that distant future because you are rushing. Definately get hunting dogs though, and the first wood upgrade. They are super cheap

In age 2 I usually get 5 Uhlans, then 3 Settler Wagons + 2 Uhlans, then 2 Settler Wagons + 2 Uhlans.

[This message has been edited by Tseng (edited 11-01-2005 @ 08:19 AM).]

posted 11-01-05 02:49 PM EDT (US)     3 / 20  
Wow, that's like a rush rush. Do you manage to break 5,000 XP per game? I think I will try this tonight, but let my enemy live so I can crush them later, and get many more XP.

How many settlers do you have to kill for them to be crippled, but continue? 8-10 sounds pretty good to me.

Thanks for such a detailed well thought out post!

posted 11-01-05 04:56 PM EDT (US)     4 / 20  
That's a killer rush and a great guide. Just one question, have you tried this vs the French? I ask because I am sure my Colonial time with them is blazing sometimes - I don't know how that might interfere with or block your early rushes.

Suckin' at Age' since AOE.
posted 11-01-05 05:01 PM EDT (US)     5 / 20  
Yeah man, it says not to attempt against the French unless you are really skilled. Those damn Coureurs are too hard to kill with Uhlans.

And Crazy, yeah Furrier would be better long term...but the entire goal in this strat is for there to be no long term.

Haha, the experience I get is usually enough to get close to gaining a level. It pretty much evens out at higher levels anyway, because it is difficult to really kill a good player in 8 minutes. It just gives you a big advantage in the long term, if you can take control of the map. Outposts at choke points and effective scouting so you can constantly raid vills is essential. I actually have modified it since this and can pull it off with 1 less villager and better resource management. I'm beginning to learn that it's all in the micro.

Tseng, I haven't really tried it with Natives but I might look into it in the future. I usually build xbows first to severely raid and then start bringing in pikes, unless I am playing Ottoman or someone that got to Colonial before I did. Then I go with pikes to counter the possible Cavalry card and take building down quicker.


Leader- OOYA (Odhinn Owns Ye All)

Also check out my band at www.myspace.com/wdreams

[This message has been edited by lordvasa (edited 11-01-2005 @ 05:09 PM).]

posted 11-01-05 05:08 PM EDT (US)     6 / 20  
The other German rush seems ALOT easier to manage and 7 troops can kill the TC instead of ammasing a huge pikeman uhlan army.

Although I have not played enough to know what is MORE effective, but this one sounds more difficult. Just my initial thoughts.

posted 11-01-05 05:15 PM EDT (US)     7 / 20  
It's more difficult, but you get a stronger econ. The other strat wastes alot of TC time as it is, and your economy will suck ass for awhile into the game. If you don't manage to take their TC down with it, you will probably lose unless you are really good.

But, then again, no strategy will let you win every time. A good player knows when to use what strategy against who.
And Alpha, after reading you post on whyabadi's strat, you would lose against anyone who knew how to rush. An 18 pop count for Colonial is suicide against a rusher.


Leader- OOYA (Odhinn Owns Ye All)

Also check out my band at www.myspace.com/wdreams

[This message has been edited by lordvasa (edited 11-01-2005 @ 05:23 PM).]

posted 11-01-05 06:57 PM EDT (US)     8 / 20  
Know what makes doing this even cooler? When you have a mayan settlement nearby...mayan spearmen own at taking down buildings. Doppels are also quite the sexy unit with their 60 siege attack and 60 dmg vs cavalry, not to mention the whole area of effect attack. Too bad they cost so much. I find it easier to make doppels than pikes sometimes actually.
posted 11-01-05 09:39 PM EDT (US)     9 / 20  

Guten Tag
A killer German rush my friend. I wouldn't call anyone who use it on me anything other than scary. But it really depends on the player and his skill.
Keeping my Uhlans alive seems like a challenge to me because towers can take them out so easily. But again it is still scary when my opponent has 5 Uhlans right outside my base waiting for my precious villagers to come out
I will try your strategy with Landsknechts instead of Uhlans, but keep the pikemen troop.
Great German strategy lordvasa
A recorded game would be appreciated.
posted 11-02-05 06:57 PM EDT (US)     10 / 20  
I have to say...on certain maps against a player with similar skill, this rush won't finish them off right away, leaving you with a pikemen army which can easily be slaughtered...
posted 11-02-05 09:56 PM EDT (US)     11 / 20  
Great post lordvasa.

I've been playing Portuguese,but have moved on to Germans and have not been doing so well with them. The only think is Portuguese can get a faster Age 2, but won't have a good army or rush. So if you're playing against a Portuguese player, and they age before you, dont worry, you can still attack them effectively.


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posted 11-02-05 10:35 PM EDT (US)     12 / 20  
What are you going to do when you face a serious turtle. Lets just assume the enemy knows this rush is coming. I can see ways to counter it using the 2nd minutemen card and pioneers card, and 2 outposts card. Not only does that give you a massive army of minutemen in just a few seconds, it makes your TownCenter have a much stronger attack.

A serious turtler, defined as someone able to beat the rush and counter-attack, would use walls to prevent raiding. My Dutch get early skirmishers. So, all I have to do is slow down villager production and use the gold to train skirmishers. Hiding behind walls and under cover fire of towers and the TC, raiding won't work well. and a small skirmisher army will defeat any infantry rush hand down. I find the best way to micro skirmishers is to use their attack move function. Press A then click on the ground near your army. this keeps the guys in back moving forward to seek new targets without manually focus firing on one guy and wasting shots as in traditional micromanaging. Once the immediate danger to my economy is gone. I march my skirmishers right into the enemy camp and start shooting at the fragile rusher's economy.

The key points are:

build walls to block raiding.

make lots of skirmishers(or archers) to fight the heavy infantry

Use outposts from cards to strengthen your walls. A wall with a tower behind it is something to fear until you have siege.

Counter attack once you overwhelm the rusher's offensive army. The counter attack is extremely important. Because when the rush fails. they will see the power of your defenses and try to boom to age 3 and get cannons.

If you are turtling. Scouting is double as important. You need to know where to wall, where attacks will be coming from, and where you need to counter attack when the time arises.

posted 11-03-05 11:40 AM EDT (US)     13 / 20  
NRS, I use mainly xbows in my rush. This is simply a general strategy until you get comfortable, and then add your own tweaks to suit your playing style. It's alot more difficult to pull the rush off just right so that your vills start wood before your 11th vill even pops out..this is the only way to ensure constant xbow production, which is why I say you have a choice between the two. Plus, having a few extra pikes lying around can mess up some cavs, so they aren't entirely useless. And 10 pikes can take down an enemies housing very quickly, especially if the majority of his army is attacking you and he didnt think to leave some light infantry at home.

After I produce about 5 more wood vills, I move a couple to food and start producing pikemen for siege. With 5 Uhlans and 10 xbows, even if I don't screw him right away...his economy is ruined for the moment. I usually keep harassing the enemy constantly so he has to counter what I do and focus on that only...my entire economy is microed from the start and I'm really keen on using the shift click commands to make sure that I never have idle vills. This allows me to focus completely on military.

And maybe turtling by an expert could defeat this strat, but I haven't found turtling a problem. Walling off choke points is fine, but since I always send one vill in as a forward for my barracks, you better make sure you wall off the right point. Is there a map where you can spare enough resources to wall your enemy off in discovery to where they can't get in? Plus, with the cards you mentioned...I would assume you would use pioneers and the town center attack cards first, and two outposts last. Not to mention I'm not sure how you plan on getting 3 card levels that quickly without attacking anyone. As far as I know, turtling isn't really that helpful to your experience total. This gives me enough time to roll in and irreparably damage your economy before you can get the outposts up. Especially if you're running around worried about turtling. Turtling was never a problem in AOK, and as far as I have seen it isn't really a problem in AOE3 either.

Like you said in your post though, constant scouting is the key and that goes for rushing too. I played a game last night where I was spot on, against a French opponent. Keep in mind that during the entire time that I am transitioning to Colonial and into the first minute of Colonial, my explorer is making a constant circle around the enemy TC...locating all of his villagers and trying to spot the barracks coming up so I can take it down with my Uhlans, or raid hunters.

I saw his outpost coming out of the TC and luckily my Uhlans were already halfway down the map. It went up in the red, and I lost 2 horses but took it town, at the same time moving 10 xbows in and raiding the hell out of his vills. The better french economy overtook me quickly, and he managed to beat back my main force...so I retreated back to my TC and focused on going Fortress and building 2 barracks. He took down my barracks and with this 30+ army including artillery (he had already gone fortress) went towards my TC. I managed to hit fortress and try to put my fort up right as he got to my town, and he destroyed it. Luckily his army was mostly light infanty and muskets but he had those annoying indian spearguys. I I had enough free cards to have also summoned 8 uhlans and 7 skirms right when I hit the fort, so by garrisoning some vills in my TC and careful microing, my much smaller force defeated his much larger force, allowing me to use my 2000 access gold to create 4 falconets. At that point things started going in my favor, and I beat him shortly after that.

I GGed him when his army hit my area the first time, and 20 minutes later he was wiped out. My point in all this is that a strategy is a good tool to help you start out, but you have to know how to adapt to the circumstances to win.


Leader- OOYA (Odhinn Owns Ye All)

Also check out my band at www.myspace.com/wdreams

[This message has been edited by lordvasa (edited 11-03-2005 @ 11:46 AM).]

posted 11-04-05 02:40 PM EDT (US)     14 / 20  
I think even if you try to attack a Port guy early he can withstand alot of punishment unless you kill his extra TC before it gets laid. If that happens, he could be in for a hurting. If not, then simply try to reach some of his villagers. Worst thing that can happen, is that you save your army and just see what happens. He might end up outbooming you and you might lose, so who knows. I know that fighting the computer on Hard I can win pretty much every time now and the Ports are the only civ I can beat him with not rushing. My economy just blows him away, so he doesn't rush because he's scared or something. Then I reach age 3 so much faster, he's toast.

I have actually not played a Port player on ESO since I've gotten down some rushes so I can't say whether I've been able to take them or not.

The skill level of players is also a complete mystery, which doesn't help.

I rushed a brit player who I could tell was good, but he said he sucked at brits and was almost always Russian. Would he have beaten me with Russians, probably.....but hey, I still got a win.

posted 11-04-05 08:50 PM EDT (US)     15 / 20  
Just one comment: the pikemen don't make sense to me. The counter to uhlans are pikemen so you want a counter to pikemen-crossbowmen. Crossbowmen also counter musketeers. If the other civ fields calvary, then yeah pikemen good, but unless that is the case crossbowmen can kill vils faster and kill cav counters.

"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
-Benjamin Franklin
posted 11-05-05 10:44 AM EDT (US)     16 / 20  
Pikemen are the best siege artillery you have in the Colonial age, and they are much, much cheaper than going Dopps. Seriously...15 pikes will take down a TC in about 30 seconds and if you have 20 xbows backing them up there is little anyone can do about it.

Leader- OOYA (Odhinn Owns Ye All)

Also check out my band at www.myspace.com/wdreams

posted 11-05-05 07:23 PM EDT (US)     17 / 20  
I have been using your strat (lordvasa) for about 5 days now and really like it. I have won about 12 of 15 games with your strat. My only problem is that I can't seem to advance faster than 4:30. My question is, how many villagers do you make before you advance? You say 13-14 in your original post. I manage to make 11 villies and advance 30 seconds later. So it doesn't seem possible to advance with 13-14 villies as fast as you claim. Do you (lordvasa) possible have a replay of your rush. Thanks
posted 11-06-05 02:59 AM EDT (US)     18 / 20  

#3
Since wood gathers much slower, wouldn't it be more efficient to ship wood crates instead of food crates?
posted 11-06-05 04:17 AM EDT (US)     19 / 20  

Quote:

First vills and settler wagon onto unpacking food crates.

After I've read this, I stopped reading.


The Wait Is Over

DoJo Clan Site
posted 11-06-05 07:17 AM EDT (US)     20 / 20  
Good job to you!
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