You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Strategy Central

Hop to:    
loginhomeregisterhelprules
Bottom
Topic Subject: Ottoman "Power Play" strategy, now even stronger in 1.06
« Previous Page  1 2 3 ··· 4  Next Page »
posted 04-13-06 11:21 PM EDT (US)   
No recordings, people I fight lately don't seem to wish to record their games, thus nothing I can do, and I no longer wish to wait to post it. So just text.

NOTE: this is only for high level Ottoman HCs. Atleast level 30 (for the alternate power play).

Required cards:
3 Villagers
700 gold
700 food
5 Spahi
1000 gold
20 sheep
Fort
6 Spahi
Factory
Factory

Recommended additional cards:
5 Janissaries
700 wood
1000 wood
2 Falconets
2 Great Bombards
9 Corsairs
5 Mamelukes
Mercenary Armies

~~~

Basic idea:
Instead of trying to turtle to Industrial, you secure your position by ruining, slowing down, disrupting and putting your opponent off balance.

~~~

Step by step:

Put down a tradepost ASAP with your explorer.

Do the fastest age up to colonial possible with the 200 gold + Outpost. If you need explaining how to do this, stop reading now, go read the "general hints" thread.

Put up that Outpost in a forward base, not so close to enemy base that it's easily spotted, but do try to make it reasonably close, and try to cover a mine and some hunts with it.
After clicking age up to Fortress, use this Outpost as the shipment dropoff point.

Age up to Fortress ASAP, eat sheep, get treasures, whatever it takes (should arrive there by 6:30), age with the 4 Hussar Politician.
If your HC is not high enough for that politician, the alternate power play is to age up with Exiled Prince. Your attack will come 60 seconds sooner, but will be weaker. If you are using the alternate power play, ignore the references to Hussars below.

SCOUT with your explorer for enemy villagers that are not right nearby the TC or their own Outpost. Don't be careful with the explorer, let him take damage if necessary, but find those villager locations.

Make sure you have a shipment and 1000 food the SECOND you arrive in Fortress. Send 5 Spahi asap (if you can't get 1000 food in 1.5 minutes, this strat is not for you). Put nearly ALL villagers on food it you have to (don't get housed, though).

By 7:10-7:20 you'll have 4 Hussars and 5 Spahi very close to the enemy base. Your explorer is stil nearby, right? If your enemy has advanced to fortress, put the Spahi and Hussars in the same group, you'll need to kill his age up troops (8 Pikes, 3 Dopplesoldners, 6 Skirmishers, 6 Cassadors, etc). If it's anti-cavalry counters, use both Hussars and Spahi for maximum punch. If it's light infantry or Cavalry, send in Spahi alone after these while sending the Hussars after villagers furthest away from the TC.

If enemy has NOT yet hit Fortress by the time you have your cavalry in his base, go directly after villagers. Split Spahi and Hussars into two groups, 4 Spahi in one group, 4 Hussars and 1 Spahi in another group (the one Spahi will do area damage and slow down multiple villagers at once, which the Hussars don't do as well by themselves). MICRO your cavalry, don't let it run around stupidly getting in the way of themselves.
When villagers start to get close to the TC, fall back, just take the fastest and most direct path away from the TC. You don't want to lose any cavalry if you can help it.

Meanwhile at home, you should be sending:
1000 gold
Fort
20 sheep (build a single pen)
1000 wood
In that order. Most of your villagers need to be on FOOD. You need 2000 food and 200 gold. Do not take villagers off food while aging up to industrial. You will need 1200 food once you reach it.

After you hit age up to Industrial and you have reached 1200 food, switch to 1/2 on wood (houses) and 1/2 gold, as you may need Mercantilism (and later Mercs).

Have the 2 Falconet card in your deck. If your opponent wants to rush, or if your raids had too many casualties, you'll need these 2 Falconets right after the Fort.

After your cavalry has fallen back for ~30-45 seconds, come back in with the explorer, find out where the villagers are now. Raid again. Repeat the entire procedure based on what troops the enemy has (he has to be in Fortress by now, or he royally sucks). Fall back just as villagers are about to Garrison.
Oh, don't fear Outposts. 4 Hussars and 5 Spahi take one down surprisingly fast and don't lose all that much HP. When the outpost is about to go down, most people panick and have their villagers leave it in hopes of reaching the TC. They're dead then (Spahi area damage). And they're dead if they don't leave. Your opponent will be forced to get troops out, probably Cavalry counters, which is exactly what you want.

Meanwhile at home, age up to Industrial with 3 Spahi.

Raid again during age up to Industrial. CONVINCE your opponent he should be getting anti cavalry, if he isn't by now.

Once you hit Industrial, your first shipment is 6 Spahi. Take your 14 Spahi (best case scenario, if all Fortress Spahi survived) and whatever surviving Hussars, raid again. If your opponent hasn't clued in he should be building anti-cav, he will be now.

You'll have hit the 25 villager limit by now. Build that church, research the cap increase and atleast the 300 food train speed upgrade.

Your next two shipments in industrial (don't care how you get 'em, Mercantilism, spaming houses, adding more trade posts, whatever you do, get them ASAP) are the two Factories. Research Mass Production ASAP. Set both Factories to produce Great Bombards.

If you haven't been already doing so, put villagers on wood and start making houses. You'll need alot of them ...

NOTE: if your raids weren't going well, and your opponent has some strength, he will consider you weak after age up to Industrial and hit you with everything he's got. In this case, ship 2 Great Bombards before you ship the factories in. Factories are useless if there's not enough troops to defend them. Otherwise ...

Anti Cavalry, meet Great Bombards.

Put down a Barracks, make 15-20 Janissaries (remember the sheep? You did build a pen right? Time to collect the food, even if it's not fully fattened yet, go for it).

If he's not braindead, he'll try to make suicide runs at your Great Bombards with melee cavalry (in 1.06 it can be ranged as well, just set to melee mode). If he makes Culverins, thank him. He is wasting resources producing them, while your Bombards are Factory produced, constantly replaced.

Keep raiding, you want to keep him out of Industrial, or arrive there with an even more horrible economy than you've already left him.

If your opponent masses culverins or cavalry, that's when the Janissaries come in. Upgrade them to atleast Veteran, Guard if you have the resources. Also keep in mind that you can just waltz in and shoot Culverins to pieces with Janissaries, they don't even make a dent in these 300+ HP monsters. If your opponent managed to produce or ship in light infantry troops or Mercs, remember those 14 Spahi ...?

Now I really shouldn't have to say how to finish this game.

Remember that much of this strategy rests on what you do with those 5 Spahi and 4 Hussars in the 7:00-7:30 time frame. Or using the alternate power play, what you do with 5 Spahi in the 6:00-6:30 timeframe. How well you use them, how much you disrupt with them, will determine how safe your age up to Industrial is, and how difficult it will be for your opponent to catch up.

Keep him from expanding. Keep him scared. Keep him making the wrong type of troops. Control the game, don't react to it.


"One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."

[This message has been edited by Ender_Ward (edited 04-13-2006 @ 11:40 PM).]

Replies:
posted 04-13-06 11:36 PM EDT (US)     1 / 98  
wow this is good...

I AM THE BUS DRIVER!
email me at juventusmonkey@hotmail.com to find out what this means...
What are you waiting for? I haven't got a single email yet! So SHOOT!
Sorry Scud, but Portugal pwns Engalnd in football
Yay C. Ronaldo! Yay Rooney...
"Woad raiders look like my dad in the morning with their striped jammies".- My friend on Zone...
posted 04-14-06 00:16 AM EDT (US)     2 / 98  
This is probably only going to work on texas.
posted 04-14-06 00:46 AM EDT (US)     3 / 98  

Quote:


This is probably only going to work on texas.

Texas is the worst map for this strat (despite the free cows) because your opponent is impossible to raid without losing cavalry.


"One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."
posted 04-14-06 01:51 AM EDT (US)     4 / 98  
That last line should be a famous AOE quote. You summed up how to win gimes in one sentence. Thanks for the detail, I'm liking this strat.
posted 04-14-06 01:56 AM EDT (US)     5 / 98  
Wow this is like the 1st otto strat on the forum that PWNSZORZ!!!!111! ONE ONE !!

subliminal messages
Can you find it...?

Chuck Norris.

posted 04-14-06 03:58 AM EDT (US)     6 / 98  
Lol, I had someone in my clan do this strat on me, only without the 4 hussars. Grenadier rush go bye bye extremely fast... I still think if your opponent puts a couple of towers up and makes some sort of anti cav you're gonna be in trouble.

But, I have to say, this strat is interesting and I'd be interested to play against it sometime. If you're intereseted in giving it a trial spin my ESO:Pcfreak8


ESO : Pcfreak8
"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is." -Jan L. A. van de Snepscheu
A pessimist is usually right and never disappointed.
Any history buff knows that nothing stops a cannon like a good uppercut. - BeatnikJoe
posted 04-14-06 05:14 AM EDT (US)     7 / 98  
Do you reckon the great bombards will be enough now that war wagons can kill them 2x as well? It's a good idea to have war wagons vs an Ottoman in any case, since they do very well vs Abus guns.

•Qazitory•
•AoE3 rating: Qazitory
My AoE3:TWC mods: QazUI - Treasure - Main Menu - Low Lag HC - Deck selection•
•Guide my keystrokes, keep my programs alive, protect me from viruses, back up my drive.•
posted 04-14-06 08:30 AM EDT (US)     8 / 98  
looks great, I'll try it when i got the time.

Being an otto rusher, I admit Otto can be a bit OP. But I'm trying to FF/Boom now, and anyway I'm a bit UP so it all balances out.
posted 04-14-06 10:59 AM EDT (US)     9 / 98  
nice guide but why age up with 4 hussars since you are getting spahis after that? isnt 4 abus better?
posted 04-14-06 11:09 AM EDT (US)     10 / 98  
4 Hussars are way better than 4 Abus Guns (or even 5 back in 1.05). The Hussars are more mobile and do a hell of alot more damage to villagers. Abus Guns only do 10 damage to villagers due to their 0.25x multiplier. Abus Guns are also very vulnerable to Lancers, which usually come from Spanish pretty soon and to Uhlans, which any German will have. Hussars aren't as vulnerable to either.

But, keep in mind that the alternate power play, depending on the speed of your opponent, is even more powerful. If your opponent is trying a delayed Fortress, having 5 Spahi in his base by 6:30 is devastating. Any Colonial troops he can ship stand absolutely zero chance. Pretty much only the German 4 Landsknecht will take out some Spahi, but will stil lose. But that's fine, 'cause you just set him back 500 gold.


"One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."
posted 04-14-06 11:21 AM EDT (US)     11 / 98  
This is similar to what I'm doing, but I've found a strat like the above is a touch too slow for major fortress players. It *may* work better now with the reduced military shipments in Fortress. Here's what I'm doing, but it's very weak against the Germans (1.05, haven't played a decent german in 1.06 yet).

1- 4 Settlers on hunt, 2 on gather 4 wood crates and then house then hunt. Waypoint on hunt from TC.
2- Kill first treasure or two with explorer then immediately build first trading post, then gather treasures towards second TP.
3- Ship 3 Settlers.
4- Age to II with 400 wood (don't know the time here, but it's FAST), move a few settlers to gold until you get 300 gold then move them back to food.
5- Gather enough wood to build second TP (and possibly market, leftovers for house during age to 3).
6- Ship 700 gold immediately upon aging to 3. If you have a second shipment (often do), use it to ship 700 wood right behind.
7- Gather gold, you'll usually be waiting on gathring the gold crates to age to 3. Very fast, usually <7min. Age to 3 with what makes you happy. I like the 4 abuse guns (I really liked 5, but I can deal with 4). Sometimes on water maps, I use wood+boat for the extra food from the boat.
8- 4th shipment is usually waiting upon age to 3. You've still got everyone hunting, so ship your 5 spahi. Use these to raid, but DON'T lose one. The strength of the spahi is that they autoupgrade on aging and they HEAL Themselves, so don't let them die. If one gets <50% HPS, send him home to hide and heal.

This is where it gets touchy. Most people will be attacking you now with something.. although in 1.06, it's not much of a force. The rush here is to get to 2000 food and to pick up 200 gold and then gather the 1000 gold shipment as quickly as possible. If I don't get rushed during this :30 seconds, I'm golden. If I do, the game slows down for me a bit.

9- Age to 4 with 3 spahi. Do not engage the attacking enemy force with your 5 spahi unless ABSOLUTELY necessary. You can use your 4 abuse to micro kill some of his seigers, especially falconet(s). Keep your spahi safely at flank distance.

When you are almost in age4.. send the minutemen. Bring in the spahi to hit just as you age to 4. You'll now have 8 kick ass spahi and 6 minutemen and 4 abuse guns that can own almost any age3 force, and definitely any age2 force. Since most age3 forces are comprised of unupgraded age2 units.. you'll be amazed at the effeciveness. I got this from the recording of it happening to Stophon4 recently.. where 8 spahi and 6 minutemen owned 6 lancers, 24 pikes, and 10 rods, with 3 spahi left (healing themselves).

Once I've quelled the FF attack, my next shipment(s) (from all the combat XP) are 2 TC wagons and 6 more spahi, and it's time to get your mosque up because you're probably at 26 settlers now. In the downtime before the opponents next big attack, I like to use the spahi to creep the big treasures for a boost.

Spahi are uber raiders, superior to Curs, because they can raid, then wait to regen, then raid, etc. The combination of spahi and being able to see falling animals through the fog of war is OP, plain and simple.

Once in 4, my game varies depending on who I'm playing. I really like the mameluke+corsair+stradiot army, but I also like 2 bombards and factory shipments. Recently, I've also been using the 8 hussar shipment.

There have been times I've been paying FI vs FI, and there is no age3 attack (which I think will be more popular now). I can't tell you how incredibly powerful it is to hit your enemy at 13 minutes with 5+3+6 spahi that are industrial. It's just dumb how powerful 14 industrial spahi really are. They can take down almost anything. They have great seige, incredible damage vs settlers and age2 infantry, and even stand up quite well to things you wouldn't think they should be able to, including landschnekts and swiss pikes.

If you want to see a dumb force for a NR game. Ship all spahi (5+3age+6+4), then go to imperial and ship them again (5+6+4) for a total of 33 spahi (could be 39 if you were really devoted). Ship the cavalry combat card and buy the melee cav upgrades at your arsenal (or better, advanced arsenal), and watch that irreplaceable force of 33 spahi tear through your opponent. If you back them up with imperial field guns.. it's unreal what they can do together. 2000 hp splash damage cavalry make a nice meatshield with teeth. If you're smart enough to pull the injured spahi out of combat on the fly and send them home to heal, they actually do replace themselves quite nicely.



Currently Lt Colonel at ~32 Power Rating (hopefully back on the rise)
My AoE3 ELO-1600 Rating
-All 8 civs at lvl 30+, non above 60. Hurts my rating, but gives me a strong understanding of my enemies.
posted 04-15-06 09:29 AM EDT (US)     12 / 98  
there are some good ideas in this topic but i do have some remarks. you only send your 1000 wood as your fifth shipment in fortress age and as you say you still put most vills on food at that time to get to 4th age quickly. if you do so you only have 1 tc and otto's make vills very slowly even if you have the full upgrade of spawing the vill card. if you have 3 tc's they get their vills very quickly. so if your raiding doesen't kill many vills or disturb him in his style of play(which will happen against an expert) then you are just ****ed because you will have the weakest eco and not your opponent because you just don't got wood to make tc's. I would send it sooner. Also you don't make much army in the third age. so if spanish player doesen't have probs with this raiding and has more shipments than you get he has greater army and destroys your outpost and your entire base(5 spahis and 2 falconets won't stop his army). you can'tget to industrial in like 10 minutes in a normal game. so the time you are in fortress makes you weak if you are doing a FI with raiding. .
posted 04-15-06 09:58 AM EDT (US)     13 / 98  
Very interesting strategy, and it's well written and explained. I'll have to try this out sometime
posted 04-15-06 10:35 AM EDT (US)     14 / 98  
I'm now leveling an otto city just so I can try this strat

ATM since I don't have the needed cards I've been doing a rush with jans, which if it fails I pull out into fortress and attack with falcs+spahi+abus+whatever jans are leftover. Seems to work fairly well.


|Ca_aok|HG Seraph wannabe|
|{ca_aok@hotmail.com}|
|{ESO2: [EEX] ca_aok}|
O-- Member of EEX, and former member of LKS --O
In the Darkness, there is Light, in the Old, there is New.
From the Void a New Star rises, Shining down for Me and You.
posted 04-15-06 11:36 AM EDT (US)     15 / 98  
sebastian_v,

Paragraphs are your friend ...

Shipments > economy. A spanish player will not be controlling tradeposts against an Ottoman. You claim the middle trade post ASAP, and the one near your own base usually cannot be used due to ES' new rule. That usually leaves the Spanish to 1 Trade Post on most maps.

And I actually do put down two more TCs either before I hit Industrial (if I have the wood) or IN Industrial, using th 2 TC Wagons card.

I also reach Industrial in about 11 minutes usually.

And I do believe I said this strategy will depend on how well you do with that raiding force. If your raids have not gone well, put down those 2 more TCs while in Fortress and try to boom. I say try, because if you haven't sufficiently crippled your opponent, you'll be in a world of trouble, 'cause it'll be a few minutes until your villager production rate is up to speed.


P.S.
I noticed in your "otto trouble" (another paragraph free) thread, that you claim to have "all the good cards". You're sending 3 Spahi instead of 5 and you consider yourself to have all the good cards?


"One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."

[This message has been edited by Ender_Ward (edited 04-15-2006 @ 11:38 AM).]

posted 04-15-06 12:23 PM EDT (US)     16 / 98  
I have been working on something similar, with a few differences. I do take advantage of the spahi cards, raiding, and whatnot that you do. But I age to colonial with the 400 wood and often send the 700 wood while I'm aging to Fortress. This allows me to grab another TP or two and still have the shipments that I need ready for Fortress. The 700 wood lets me plop down a TC right when I get there also.
posted 04-15-06 12:40 PM EDT (US)     17 / 98  
looks like a great strat, at least it requires alot more skill than ff .
posted 04-15-06 07:37 PM EDT (US)     18 / 98  
Shipments > economy. A spanish player will not be controlling tradeposts against an Ottoman. You claim the middle trade post ASAP, and the one near your own base usually cannot be used due to ES' new rule. That usually leaves the Spanish to 1 Trade Post on most maps.
-----------------------------------

Whats ES' new rule?


Whisky Tango Foxtrot!?
posted 04-16-06 12:28 PM EDT (US)     19 / 98  

Quote:


Whats ES' new rule?

Can't build a trade post close to enemy Town Center. Introduced in the previous patch.


"One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."
posted 04-16-06 03:51 PM EDT (US)     20 / 98  
Try incorporating enginering school too great bombards replace faster. I'd also suggest making the jans alot earlier.
posted 04-16-06 06:22 PM EDT (US)     21 / 98  
Earlier Jans are unnecessary unless the enemy is massing Dragoons or Ruyters. Or until I need heavy protection for the Great Bombards from melee cavalry. Spahi + Hussars just overrun most of the rest.

I used to send the Engineering School card, but ES nerfed it. It used to be -25% train time, but now it's only -10%, not really worth it IMO.


"One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."

[This message has been edited by Ender_Ward (edited 04-16-2006 @ 06:23 PM).]

posted 04-16-06 06:31 PM EDT (US)     22 / 98  
-10% may sound crap. the difference of now to before is actually not much.

before you were making Hc/GB at 50% train time, now it is 65%. not too bad.

comepared 75% other wise, you get 1 free bonbad for every 6.5 made, since you have 2 factories, you get 2 free bombards every time.

posted 04-16-06 09:23 PM EDT (US)     23 / 98  
Umm, didn't ES fix engineering school to not apply to factory cannon in 1.05? You guys might just be wasting a card...

|Ca_aok|HG Seraph wannabe|
|{ca_aok@hotmail.com}|
|{ESO2: [EEX] ca_aok}|
O-- Member of EEX, and former member of LKS --O
In the Darkness, there is Light, in the Old, there is New.
From the Void a New Star rises, Shining down for Me and You.
posted 04-16-06 09:35 PM EDT (US)     24 / 98  
due to popular demand, their nerfed it from -25% to -10%
posted 04-16-06 10:00 PM EDT (US)     25 / 98  
Good to know, maybe Ill include it in some decks now.

|Ca_aok|HG Seraph wannabe|
|{ca_aok@hotmail.com}|
|{ESO2: [EEX] ca_aok}|
O-- Member of EEX, and former member of LKS --O
In the Darkness, there is Light, in the Old, there is New.
From the Void a New Star rises, Shining down for Me and You.
« Previous Page  1 2 3 ··· 4  Next Page »
Age of Empires III Heaven » Forums » Strategy Central » Ottoman "Power Play" strategy, now even stronger in 1.06
Top
You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register
Hop to:    
Age of Empires III Heaven | HeavenGames