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Topic Subject: Ottoman DePorter
posted 07-21-06 02:04 AM EDT (US)   
Hello all

Though I'm a very new Ottoman player, I have made up something that might interest you. It is a new strat, and still under testing... so any comments would be appreciated. I have used it and beaten good players and since some people asked me to post it...

WTH is that thing?

Ottoman DePorter (any similarity is just coincidence) is a strat that I have made thinking in ways to beat Portugal with Ottomans (duh). It seems that rushing doesn't work really well, so the only viable strats most of the time are FIs or FFs (The last one also doesn't work so well). Though I have little experience with Ottomans I can say that I know something about Portugal, so I think it deserves some credit

So what should we do?

The main objective is to explore your enemy weakness. It was made thinking in ways to beat Portugal, so I have made it thinking in Portugal weakness (yes, they have them too) but it may also work against other civs. But which are Portugal weakness? The most important of them is the great ammount of food needed to supply their army/economy - they can't power it through Settler shipments so constant Settler production is a must to don't fall behind your enemy.

Other one is the high effect that any kind of pressure has over Portugal. You may think that those damn TCs will just own your army - but to make them shoot, they need to have idle Settlers inside. So, if one of the things so feared about Portugal are their TC power, it means they do garrison a lot, uh?

And, my favorite one: Total lack of Siege Artillery.

Needed Cards:

  • 3 Settlers
  • 700 Gold
  • 700 Wood
  • 1000 Wood
  • Fort

    Important Cards:

  • 8 Janissaries
  • 5 Abus
  • 2 Falconets
  • 5 Spahi
  • 3 Spahi
  • 1000 Food
  • 2 Factories


    The Build Order:

    Discovery Age:

    At this point you just need to do the basic Ottoman Colonial. Build a TP + House with the starting wood and all Settlers go to food. Scout a lot for resources near your opponent's base and also look for treasures. Wood treasures are priority right now. Age up ASAP with the Governor (200 Gold/1 Outpost Wagon)

    Now target all your Settlers to wood. Send 3 Settlers to your enemy base and build an outpost covering the most resources you can (huntables are a priority). After you got 250 wood for it, make the Settlers in your base gather the needed resources for a FF. Set the shipment drop off point to your forward Outpost.

    Colonial Age:

    With your forward Settlers you must lure his hunt to behind your Outpost. Build another Outpost with your Outpost Wagon covering more huntables and, if possible, build it near enough so it can shot his Settlers. Do not forget to send 700 Gold at your base...

    When he age up he will face 2 Outposts. Building a Covered Wagon near any of them is almost suicide. That means they can't make their Settlers gather near the TC because they are being shot - so they totally lose the TC covering advantage. He will probably put his TC behind the Outpost line...

    Now send the 700 Wood card. Collect it and use it to build at least 2 Houses + Barracks. The rest of the wood you can use for another outpost or any other building that you like. Age up to Fortress with 4 Abus or 4 Hussars. Barrack placement is also important - building it near resources also mean he can't gather there without having Janissaries shooting his Settlers. As soon as your forward Barracks is ready start to build 5 Janissaries.

    Fortress Age:

    Ship your aged up units in one of your forward Outposts. If you have done it right, your enemy should be confused and will either palce his 3rd TC inside his base or try to go for a place that you aren't "covering". That is what you want him to do - analyze the possibilities well and you should guess where the 3rd TC will go. Move your troops to that place and catch the Wagon if you can.

    If it worked, you have surrounded him and has map control now. He has almost no huntables and soon will stop training Settlers or have to make mills/use berries. You should use your shipments to apply pressure: start sending 8 Janissaries/5 Abus/2 Falconets and later 5 Spahis. When you're sure he is locked, ship a Fort to make sure he won't leave. You can also send 1000 Wood and build a Town Center and a Church to power your economy.

    Overall:

    As you can see this is an Ottoman FF that rely on Outposts to keep your enemy under control. Its a simple strat which just needs some modifications in your normal FF. You lure his hunt, raid his Settlers and can even take his Covered Wagon. In a simple point of view you are herding your enemy, you are taking the control of the game and making he play it. He is not playing his game - he is playing your game.

    This, of course, is not 100% effective in all maps. Some such as New England, Yukon or Texas are easier to cover, while in Great Plains there are too many huntables to cover them all. Even in Bayou and Hispaniola (unless he ship boom...) it is effective - these maps are easy to cover and you use the starting wood for an Outpost rather than the Trading Post.

    But it is still in testing so any oppinions or tips would be apreciated

    Record Games (More coming soon)

    VS Flammifer (Aproved): This is the perfect game to show how to control your enemy. I have lured his hunt, applyed pressure, my Outposts made his Covered Wagon turn back and I was able to kill his 3rd Age Covered Wagon which tried to escape through the only viable route. You will also see that in an act of desesperation he tries to hunt literally on my base! Of course, I also made some really lame mistakes... I applyed the needed pressure but totally forgot about my Settlers which were dying to his constant raids... And this is also the only game that I have ever seen the Mohawk Politician being used effectively


    ESO - Walker

    >> Napoleonic Era --> Visit their Homepage!
    "Holy *****" > Thunder (Ensemble Studios)

    Retired from AoE3. But I do play AoK HD in Steam now and then.

    [This message has been edited by Just a player (edited 08-03-2006 @ 07:22 PM).]

  • Replies:
    posted 07-21-06 02:22 AM EDT (US)     1 / 23  
    Having been one of the test subjects for this strat, I can say that it's eeeeevil.

    All of a sudden you wonder "Hey! Where did all my hunts go?" It's complete and total containment. You can't break out without making a Barracks and training Pikes, which slows you down alot, and just makes you more vulnerable to his marauding Jans and later Fortress troops.

    It works, and quite well.


    "One wants to be loved, failing that admired, failing that feared, failing that hated and despised. One wants to instill in other people some form of emotion. The soul shudders before emptiness and wants contact, no matter the cost."
    posted 07-21-06 02:28 AM EDT (US)     2 / 23  
    I like this strat

    It reminds me a bit of tower rushing in AoC, luring hunts to the forward tower seems to be a good idea. I tend to send one villager early on to herd the next huntables closer, so I believe it'd make the strategy somewhat less effective but you'll get map control from a Port player in any case. Should work with civs other than Ottos as well, if you have good shipments.


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    posted 07-21-06 09:04 AM EDT (US)     3 / 23  
    I think the fact that this works so well points to some issues with basic game mechanics. They try to cover up for it with the no build area but the problem is still there. Why not post both of the game we played? The first build was a little different but omfg if that fort had gone up....

    NerVe Clan
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    posted 07-21-06 09:30 AM EDT (US)     4 / 23  
    reminds me of my spanish cross strategy with the towers

    Babbled's Rules of AOE

    1) As Spanish never play against Ottomans
    2) As Ottomans never play against the Portugese
    3) As Portugese never play against the Spanish
    4) Never play against the Germans

    posted 07-21-06 09:33 AM EDT (US)     5 / 23  
    Your forts never go up, flammifer

    The hunt idea is clever, I think I did that once in a strelet rush. It allows you to gather his resources and deny him of them at the same time.

    I have a question: What if the Port gets into colonial before you, and your outpost wagon doesn't make it to the spot before he has the TC going up? (he can call out minutemen when he sees your wagon, even if its going up)


    I am Rumour Kontrol.
    posted 07-21-06 10:01 AM EDT (US)     6 / 23  

    Quote:

    Should work with civs other than Ottos as well, if you have good shipments.

    In fact, it does. I had the idea for this strat when I remember a game in which a Spanish player blocked me on Texas with massed Outposts at one side and a Fort at the other. Spain should do this quite well due to the Governor Politician, strong FF and extra shipments.

    Quote:

    I think the fact that this works so well points to some issues with basic game mechanics. They try to cover up for it with the no build area but the problem is still there. Why not post both of the game we played? The first build was a little different but omfg if that fort had gone up....

    But that was the first game that I tried that strategy, so I did an weaker BO. I did not build a T, but instead a forward outposts. I also did not lure your hunting and due to no TP I couldn't send the 700 Wood shipment -> which housed me as soon as I hit Fortress. Being housed I ended up sending the Fort, but it never made it...

    I could post it, but it actually had an weak BO wich was improved in our second game, so I don't think its worth it

    BTW: Nice walls. Walls > Spahi raiding.

    Quote:

    I have a question: What if the Port gets into colonial before you, and your outpost wagon doesn't make it to the spot before he has the TC going up? (he can call out minutemen when he sees your wagon, even if its going up)

    I don't considerate that a problem... your first Outpost is built by your forward Settlers while the second one is the Wagon which should be dropped there. If he made something like a 10 Settler fast Colonial its because he was expecting a rush, so he will put his 2nd TC inside the range of the first and lock himself in his base while making a delayed Fortress. That is actually great, because he just gave you total map control without need of a fight.

    If he does a normal Colonial you both should arrive there at the same time. Even if your Outpost Wagon was shiped in your TC, you can walk with it and have it up not much later than his TC - because Outpost Wagons build way faster than TCs. IF he is already build his TC, great - put your Covered Wagon right next to it. As I said, he will be dead now, because he can't have their Settlers collect next to his TC without being shot. That means that a Settler will die every 5 mins and he will be annoyed for constant alarms, which will take out his attention of any attack/raid you might make in the future. If he moves his Settlers far from the TC you can just own them with your army or even ship Spahis as your first Fortres shipment

    Thanks for the nice feedback guys.

    EDIT: Game updated


    ESO - Walker

    >> Napoleonic Era --> Visit their Homepage!
    "Holy *****" > Thunder (Ensemble Studios)

    Retired from AoE3. But I do play AoK HD in Steam now and then.

    [This message has been edited by Just a player (edited 07-21-2006 @ 10:04 AM).]

    posted 07-21-06 01:42 PM EDT (US)     7 / 23  
    Nice strat, I'll try it on Kasa sometime..

    However if he has his explorer scouting his front and calls out minutemen near the right moment, you're screwed..

    Btw it doesn't work on New England, I think Yukon was perfect for that strat, you'll have to try it on other terrains sometime.

    I tried to deport on New England against a 2.1k but failed, so I had to fish boom, FI, and bombard who/red my way to victory.

    Ok: I didn't rec my game vs Kasa, but it was successful, although it turned out different than your game vs Flammifer. He stayed in colonial, built muskets and pikes to destroy my towers, and he had a group of villies on the north side hunting, but I did beat him, because he traded age for resources. At the end my jan spam overwhelmed him, along with 6 stradiots.

    ok just check my custom game stats k?

    IT DOESN'TWORK ON WATER MAPS btw.

    I lost to Kasa on Yucatan, shipped 2 caravels on wrong side of sea, he was fishing on both sides, his 2nd TC guarded the other sea, gg. I quit at 5:44

    [This message has been edited by synch (edited 07-21-2006 @ 03:44 PM).]

    posted 07-21-06 06:04 PM EDT (US)     8 / 23  

    Quote:

    I tried to deport on New England against a 2.1k but failed, so I had to fish boom, FI, and bombard who/red my way to victory.

    Hmm... I didn't do it on New Englands yet, but can you tell me why is it bad? 2 Outposts can easily cover all hunt over him, and covering the middle of the map should not be hard. You just have to attack through 2 front. This map also gives opportunites like Cherokees and a Frigate in one of the lakes

    Quote:

    IT DOESN'TWORK ON WATER MAPS btw.

    That depends imo... Making good use of Outposts you can also guard the shoreline, and also aging up with the Galley + 400 Wood would help a lot. Of course, you probably can't do it that well in some maps such as Hispaniola, but Yucatan shoreline is quite easy to cover - just 1 Outpost in each side.

    But its nice to see this strat does work even for higher rated players


    ESO - Walker

    >> Napoleonic Era --> Visit their Homepage!
    "Holy *****" > Thunder (Ensemble Studios)

    Retired from AoE3. But I do play AoK HD in Steam now and then.

    [This message has been edited by Just a player (edited 07-21-2006 @ 06:06 PM).]

    posted 07-21-06 06:19 PM EDT (US)     9 / 23  
    New England has two starting hunt piles within TC view, it's suicide for your villies...........

    Hm... maybe I screwed up on Yucatan today, but Kasa's starting TC did cover some fishing... I'll try it on more players.

    Greatest strat ever imo, it's not everyday a strat from here beats a 2.3k.

    Of course it's unrated because we're clannies so maybe he didn't play his best.

    Walker you looking for a clan? We're #9.

    [This message has been edited by synch (edited 07-21-2006 @ 06:27 PM).]

    posted 07-21-06 06:29 PM EDT (US)     10 / 23  

    Quote:

    New England has two starting hunt piles within TC view, it's suicide for your villies...........

    Good point.

    Quote:

    Greatest strat ever imo, it's not everyday a strat from here beats a 2.3k.

    Is he a 2.3k? o.O

    Well, thanks a lot. This is the first strat of mine that I have posted and I really didn't expect such nice comments... I was even waiting for some flames

    I'll keep doing it and try to improve. I still need to get that 4 Outposts card and see how usefull it is. Maybe even try to do some kind of FI while holding him with Outposts + Fort.

    Quote:

    Walker you looking for a clan? We're #9.

    Sorry, I'm already in a clan. We're like 30th... but its a clan of friends and I have no plans of leaving it. But thanks for the invite


    ESO - Walker

    >> Napoleonic Era --> Visit their Homepage!
    "Holy *****" > Thunder (Ensemble Studios)

    Retired from AoE3. But I do play AoK HD in Steam now and then.

    [This message has been edited by Just a player (edited 07-21-2006 @ 06:36 PM).]

    posted 07-21-06 06:33 PM EDT (US)     11 / 23  

    Quote:

    I was even waiting for some flames

    ZOMFG!!! This strat sux!!1 omg noob... If I had done this that and the other you would have got pwnzored.

    Sorry, not one to disappoint


    ESO : Pcfreak8
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    posted 07-21-06 06:39 PM EDT (US)     12 / 23  
    muwuahaha.

    whoever thought of the day that people make civilisation specific anti-port strats. : )


    well done.

    posted 07-21-06 07:13 PM EDT (US)     13 / 23  
    Walker belongs to our clan so hands off. MUHAHAHAHA. i challenge someone to use this technique to beatStarsky or Ruthless.
    posted 07-21-06 10:23 PM EDT (US)     14 / 23  
    Trust me, the 4 outpost cards aren't that useful, i'll go down quickly to 5 ronins with 120 siege each, I don't think FI's viable, because the longer ports last, the stronger it is. I only use it on water maps.

    Also, without a military you can't keep him "really" contained, for example Kasa had hunters and miners on the northern part of Yukon, if I didn't have my army of jans and spahi to keep him contained with towers to stop his TC wagons.

    Port's military is relatively weak, without map control Port sucks.

    He was 2.3k like two weeks ago, he's in a rate dip, he's 2260 right now.

    ESO nick = IamKasa

    posted 08-01-06 03:26 PM EDT (US)     15 / 23  
    I found this strat realy useful; i won most all bt one of my games vs ports using it. (he fished boomed and owned me in the end, cuz my towers weren't close enough to sea)

    O... and to whoever said:'i challenge someone to use this technique to beatStarsky or Ruthless' i say nobody in his right mind would take on a FM except another FM and i doubt that StarSky or Ruthless__ would play u even unrated

    This strat works against intermediate players and is pretty good for that level. Sometimes u beat higher lvls who dont expect it but thats all.

    And its just SILLY saying FMs would beast that strat btw


    Edit: how do u quote someone im new on this forum

    [This message has been edited by Mr_Hunt (edited 08-01-2006 @ 03:27 PM).]

    posted 08-02-06 03:07 AM EDT (US)     16 / 23  
    i dont see why everyone says ports have no siege power... they do have pikes etc like everyone else..
    posted 08-02-06 01:23 PM EDT (US)     17 / 23  

    Quote:

    i dont see why everyone says ports have no siege power... they do have pikes etc like everyone else..

    Because they don't have Falconets, because they don't have great siege units shipments (Like 12 Pikes) and they don't have the resources to afford sieging units in early Fortress: They must use all they get to counter their enemy.

    I think its going to rox even more now. You can use the Exiled Prince which is still 30 seconds and get Fortress way faster than him. He can use that too... but Portugal without 6 Cassadores is way weaker than Ottomans without 4 Abus

    My only deception is that Abus don't counter Light Cav...


    ESO - Walker

    >> Napoleonic Era --> Visit their Homepage!
    "Holy *****" > Thunder (Ensemble Studios)

    Retired from AoE3. But I do play AoK HD in Steam now and then.

    [This message has been edited by Just a player (edited 08-02-2006 @ 03:16 PM).]

    posted 08-03-06 01:08 AM EDT (US)     18 / 23  
    4 some reason i have the urge to merge this with Ultimitus Deporter. Maybe like Fast Cossacks then 700 wood then imprison him and send Faster traning card so u can quickly make strells if he sends ronin. Blockhouse is now a rax/outpost and a house

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    posted 08-03-06 01:35 AM EDT (US)     19 / 23  
    WOW NEAT STRAT I GOTTA CHECK OUT THE REC GAME
    YOU LIL LEGEND !

    Peace out
    My strats:
    Russian Fast, Agressive Strelet FF - FASAF - http://aoe3.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/forums/display.cgi?action=ct&f=15,30817,0,10
    Ottoman super rush-http://aoe3.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/forumsdisplay.cgi?action=ct&f=15,30144,0,10
    Super fast Port FF-http://aoe3.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/forums/display.cgi?action=ct&f=15,30145,0,10
    posted 03-18-07 02:24 PM EDT (US)     20 / 23  
    is this replay still available plz folks?
    posted 03-18-07 02:45 PM EDT (US)     21 / 23  
    A strat to beat Portugal...isnt that like making a plan to beat up a retarded kid?
    J/K sounds pretty fun to do agaisnt civs other than Ports.

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    posted 03-18-07 03:04 PM EDT (US)     22 / 23  
    When I made the strategy (half year ago) Portugal was one of the strongest civilizations! Not to mention they used to own Ottomans on FF wars

    And the replay is there, although I don't think you can watch it with the current patch.


    ESO - Walker

    >> Napoleonic Era --> Visit their Homepage!
    "Holy *****" > Thunder (Ensemble Studios)

    Retired from AoE3. But I do play AoK HD in Steam now and then.
    posted 03-19-07 04:49 AM EDT (US)     23 / 23  
    thank you Cherub
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