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Topic Subject: Basic Guide to India
posted 01-28-10 05:11 PM EDT (US)   
Basic Guide to India

This guide is going to give a basic overview and strategy description of India as a civilization. India is a very fun and versatile civilization to play, and are also one of the STRONGEST civilizations on Robot Entertainment TAD patch.

Wonders
First of all, India is an Asian civilization, so ages up by building one of the following wonders:
Agra Fort
A large fort-type wonder that is great for map control. The Agra naturally isn’t as strong as an age 3 European fort, but is still a force to be reckoned with: 5K HP and 25 ranged damage with area in colonial age is very strong. Also gives sepoys upon aging which can be very useful for a rush.
Karni Mata
This wonder provides a gathering bonus to all nearby villagers. This wonder is a great option for India in team games or if one wants to play more “boomy”. Karni Mata delivers varied crates upon age up.
Taj Mahal
This wonder gives India the “Cease Fire” Ability. Therefore any time during the game the Indian player may use Cease Fire so that all fighting will stop (buildings will still be able to shoot at units though). This wonder can be very effective when FFing so that the extra couple seconds from cease fire can give the Indian player the needed time to age up and ship units. Additionally this wonder gives a substantial amount of gold, thus being even more useful for FFing.
Tower of Victory
This wonder provides another special ability. This ability called “Inspiration” increases the unit speed, attack, and HP, thus shortly giving your army a substantial boost which when effectively used can be devastating. Additionally this wonder gives wood upon aging thus helping the Indian player crank out villagers, build houses, make military buildings, or something else perhaps.
Charminar Gate
This wonder is able to train special Mansabdar units. Mansabdar units when used provide a HP and attack bonus to regular units of the same type. Although this can be useful in many situations, the main perk of this wonder in supremacy is that it delivers mahouts when used to age to 3 or later ages.


Key Units
India is known for having a HUGE selection of units, particularly in colonial age.
The Sepoy:
Sepoys are Indian version of the commonly seen musketeer. However, similar to janissaries and ashigarus, sepoys are more expensive and stronger than the regular musketeer counterpart.
Gurkha:
Gurkha is India’s age 2 skirmisher unit. Gurkha’s have very strong attack for *LI, but as a trade off have slightly lower range early game (range increases as gurkha is upgraded). Nevertheless, gurkha remains as one of the strongest skirmisher units in the game.
Urumi:
Urumis are not able to be built, only shipped in from the home city. They are melee units that do a ranged attack with bonus against Heavy Infantry. Urumi’s can be compared to *LI counter-wise.
Sowar:
The sowar is a camel similar to European Heavy Cavalry. However like most other Asian cavalry, the sowar has bonus vs *LI, thus making it very effective vs those units, but has a penalty vs Heavy infantry, thus making it more specialized and LESS versatile than European cavalry. Additionally since the sowar is specialized, it loses in cav vs cav battles against European cavalry.
Zamburak:
Zamburaks are camel units as well comparable to European ranged cavalry. Zamburaks are extremely deadly cavalry counters especially once desert terror card is sent. Are very useful since they are one of the few ranged cav available in colonial age.
Mahout:
The Mahout is an elephant unit that acts like Heavy Cavalry. Mahouts have tremendous HP and strong splash attack with bonuses vs *LI, but penalties vs HI. Mahouts are also very population heavy and expensive.
Howdah:
Howdahs are elephants also, but are like Light Cavalry. They have a very strong ranged attack with bonuses against Heavy Cavalry and Artillery.
Siege Elephant:
An elephant mounted with a cannon that is the Indian version of a cannon. It is powerful vs artillery and buildings, and is somewhat decent vs infantry. A main plus of the siege elephant is that unlike regular cannons, it can hit/run to some extent, but does vastly less damage.


Key Cards- Note: Indian cards come with 1 villager.
Not all these cards will fit in every deck, but they can be used in specific situations/match ups outlined in the next section.
Age 1: Distribuvatism (wood trickle), Exotic Hardwoods
Age 2: 5 sepoys, 4 sowar, 600 wood, 700 food, Foreign Logging, Desert Terror, Camel Attack, Diplomatic Intrigue, 10 Tiger Claws, 2 caravels (obviously only on water maps), 2 Flail Elephants (only in team games)
Age 3: Intervention, Royal Green Jackets, British East India Company, Team 5 urumi (team games), 7 urumi, 3 mahouts, 2 siege elephants, 9 zamburaks(note: has become 8 on FP), 8 zamburaks, 9 sepoys, 8 gurkhas, 2 mahouts
Age 4: Team Shivaji’s Tactics, 9 urumi

Basic Strategies
10/10 Rush NOTE: This is best done on RE Patch, it has been weakened on the Fanpatch.
One of the most common and very powerful India strategy relying on a very fast sepoy based rush.
1.First of all, this rush is BEST performed if you start with enough wood to get 10 villagers WITHOUT gathering any wood. It can also be done with 100 less wood, but your rush is drastically slowed then.
2.Start gathering wood crates, 1 villager per wood crate and send the remaining villagers to hunt. Cue up villagers ASAP with waypoint set at hunts. DO NOT build any houses.
3.**Use monks to explore map /treasure hunt, to be most effective split them up to scout the most area. However remember that since you have 2 monks they individually are both weaker than a regular explorer. If you find a nice big treasure then team them up and use both of their stuns.** Note: I will not say this step in later strategies, but it is IMPLIED and a MUST for every civ and strategy.
4. Once you have ~600 food send 2 villagers forward to a open spot for your agra fort. Be sure to cover some resources with it.
5.Ship Distribuvatism
6.Start building agra with 2 villagers.
7.Put 8 villagers on wood and get house ASAP, once you are able to start building villagers again, move about 4 of those back on food and 2 on gold **exact numbers vary depending on treasures**
8.Try and get another house up.
**These next steps will happen very fast, so try and do them ASAP**
9.Once aged, your 2 sepoys will show up, send them up to your agra fort.
10.Start building sepoys from agra fort. **You may find it better using gurkha depending on what units your opponent is making **
11.Ship 5 sepoys and set agra as the receiving point for this shipment. **4 sowars can be useful if fighting against *LI **
12.Keep building villagers and houses based on your population.
13.Once you have 7 sepoys (with 5 more shipping) start cuing up more and send those 7 sepoys to attack your opponent. **Tip: It is helpful to send your monks in to attack, they have very nice siege and can be very useful for fighting sepoy counters**
14.Try and cause damage, if you see a barracks or stable take that down, also try and get some villagers
15.You sacrificed your economy for a fast and strong rush, so you MUST keep up pressure. If you feel that you cannot defeat him, still go on sepoy raids (shooting villagers, burning down houses, etc.)
16.If your opponent is making lots of HI or *LI, consider shipping 4 sowars and making gurkha.
17.Alternatively 600 wood can be nice as it allows you to keep up constant villager production and perhaps get a consulate and ally with brits (HP bonus!) or ottomans so that you can get 4 settlers.
18.Alternatively you can ship 700 food or 600 gold and try to age. It is often best to age with charminar gate to age 3 as you will receive a mahout upon age up.
19.After the initial rush, you have to be versatile and adapt to your opponent.


Agra Containment
This strategy also uses the Agra fort, but rather than a fast rush sacrificing economy, this will allow you to age up more leisurely with a bigger economy and rely on Agra fort for map control.
1.Set 1 villager per wood crate, 1 goes to hunts and rest on wood.
2.Cue up villagers and send to wood until you have 6 on wood, and then send rest to food
3.Build a house whenever you can manage, make sure to keep constant villager production though.
4.Send distribuvatism
5.After distribuvatism arrives move ~3 villagers off wood and to food.
6.Once you have ~600 food send 2 villagers to forward base location covering resources
7.Start building Agra fort
8.Keep up villager production and get another house
9.Distribute ~2 villagers to gold **Note: All these villager distributions are approximate and can vary based on treasures/starting crates**
10.Once aged send the 2 sepoys to your agra fort and cue up more sepoys (or gurkhas, situational depending on your opponent’s army/civ)
***Card choice***
11.At this point you have several options. Generally, you can send 600 wood to get a consulate/caravensi/housing/villagers/market, or could send 5 sepoys/4 sowar to rush. If you go with 600 wood option ally with either ottomans at consulate for 4 villager shipment if going eco heavy, or brits for 10% HP boost for your army to be stronger.
12.Remember that with agra you have map control, so take advantage of that and try and constantly raid/harass your opponent as much as possible.
13.From there on you have many options. You can add a caravensi and go sepoy+sowar or gurkha+zamburak or a combination of all! Additionally if you want you could pressure a bit with sepoys/gurkha and then age to fortress for your strong fortress shipments.
14.Needless to say, the choices are up to you, adapt to what your opponent does and try and counter his units/strategy as best as you can.


Fast Fortress
A naked Fast fortress may not be India’s best option as they are very well suited to colonial play, but nevertheless it is still pretty quite strong (especially on RE patch). A huge bonus of India’s FF is the great shipments India gets in fortress. Some of these shipments are by far the strongest in the game (3 mahouts!), but you do have to pay significant food amounts to use many of these excellent shipments.
1.Standard discovery age up as previous Build.
2.However, you do NOT age up with agra fort in this case, rather once you have 800 food, start building taj mahal in your base with 2 villagers. **Note: Place your Taj Mahal smartly, perhaps in front of your town center, but still within town center fire range so that it can create a small “barrier” to slow down your opponent slightly.
3.Keep 3 villagers on wood and send ~6 to gold and rest to food. You want to aim to have 400 gold ready upon age up, once you get 400 gold move those gold villagers back to food.
4.Once you age up you should have around 500 gold(preferably a bit more if you think you'll need MM), so gather the 500 age up gold and move all gold villagers to food since then you have total of 1000 gold needed to age up.
5.Send 700 food shipment ASAP.
6.Keep making villagers and treasure hunting(XP treasures/ lifestock GOOD!). Build house whenever necessary.
7.Gather the 700 food crates and start building Charminar gate with 4 villagers.
8.** This step can vary. Often if you got lifestock/xp treasures you will have another shipment ready immediately, if this is the case send 600 wood and use it for consulate (ally with brits), barracks, villagers/housing. If you are still not ready for a shipment, just hold on and use it once you hit fortress). If you are being attacked or going to be attacked soon (scout to figure this out) send 5 sepoy. Make sure to keep your sepoy/monks aside until you age up so that you can send your age up mahout/2 monks/5 sepoy/asian minute men/TC fire on your opponent synchronized which often will be able to destroy most age 2 armies. Additionally remember that you can use cease fire, if you just need a couple more seconds to get age up mahout or shipment.
9.While aging put a majority of your villagers onto FOOD. Your strong shipments such as 3 mahouts, 7 urumi, 2 mahouts, 2 siege elephants all require food to ship and also quite a bit of population so be sure to build a couple houses (preferably get your population cap to at least 40)
10.Upon aging you should have or nearly have a shipment. SCOUT WELL and see what you may need. If your opponent has a bunch of *LI consider shipping 3 mahouts (awesome shipment btw!) with brit consulate they have massive HP and are a pain to kill. Also 7 urumi is very nice vs infantry based armies. 9 zamburaks(8 on FP)and 8 gurkhas/sepoys are also very powerful, and do NOT cost resources to send so can be quite useful as well. 2 siege elephants is a nice shipment, but usually don’t send it until you have some army to defend them.
11.As India you have a huge variety of great age 3 shipments to send. To pick your shipments look at your opponent’s army and try and counter it as best as you can.

Tower of Victory age 2 ***Note: Adapted from incognoto’s build order utilizing the tower***
1.Same discovery build as previous
2.Age with 3 villagers on tower of victory.
3.Have about 5 villagers on wood to keep constant villager production+house and put about 4 on gold with the rest on food.
4.Upon aging gather the 400 wood age up crates and build barracks+house +villagers
5.Start building a sepoy or gurkha from barracks (depends on what opponent is making, if you are not sure it’s a good idea to make first batch sepoy since they are more versatile)
6.**Card choices** you have several options here: 600 wood is a great card and will allow you to get a stable up+ consulate +housing and villagers. 5 sepoys or 4 sowars can also be used based on what your opponent is doing.
7.This style of play allows you to have a decent economy and once you have a stable+barracks a very STRONG combo to go is zamburak+gurkha if you can micro well, if you can’t micro that well then sepoy+sowar may be better , of course you should base your combo on what your opponent does!


Karni Mata colonial play
Karni mata is a great Indian wonder particularly because of its gather boost. Also the varied crates it gives can also be quite helpful. However due to the more economical nature of this wonder, I often find it better to use mainly in team games as it allows you to get an excellent eco and spam out zamburak very well (zamburaks are excellent anticav to use in team games as they counter cav much HARDER than most other age 2 units and are also fast). Nevertheless, it can still be used effectively in 1vs 1 if you want to play focusing more on economy.
1.Standard discovery build (see above)
2.Start building Karni Mata with 2 villagers, POSITION IS VERY IMPORTANT. Karni Mata only improves gather rates on resources CLOSE to it, so be sure to position the Karni Mata close to your mines/trees and herd a hunt close to it as well to maximize your economy.
3.While aging keep about 8 villagers on wood for constant villager production+housing. Split the remaining villagers equally on food/gold if you are going zamburak/sowars. Additionally you will need 200 wood upon age up to immediately put down a barracks or stable.
4.**Villager distributions do vary for above step, be sure that you gather enough wood to be making villagers+house+200 wood for military building upon age up. Also try and go for wood treasures as they will be extremely useful**
5.Upon age up build military building of choice (stable or barracks) and cue up units from there asap.
6.Remember to keep building villagers!
7.As your shipment it is often great to send 600 wood to help with villager production/housing/consulate. Additionally you could build another military building with your wood crates. However, depending on how much your opponents are pressuring you, 5 sepoy or 4 sowar can also be very effective.
8.In team games to maximize your zamburaks be sure to send desert terror (OP card, makes zams completely OWN cav) and camel attack boost(very strong )
9.On the whole zams are extremely great units on RE patch in team games, so abuse them to the max by having your team mate(s) build lots of *LI which will be protected from cav by your extremely efficient anticav.



recordings

QUACK

[This message has been edited by crazyLUNATIC (edited 01-28-2010 @ 05:18 PM).]

Replies:
posted 01-28-10 05:14 PM EDT (US)     1 / 23  
sowar is a really dumb unit WTF 7.5 speed!?!?!
posted 01-28-10 05:57 PM EDT (US)     2 / 23  
sowar is a really dumb unit WTF 7.5 speed!?!?!
yes camels are quite fast

QUACK
posted 01-28-10 06:28 PM EDT (US)     3 / 23  
india is an insane civ, nicely written sunil

SUNIL IS NUB!!!

Battle.net:Bart (227)
ESO:Bart331
posted 01-28-10 06:35 PM EDT (US)     4 / 23  
What can I say about this guide ??
















OP
posted 01-30-10 00:34 AM EDT (US)     5 / 23  
This is one of the nicest guides I have seen in a while. Only comments would be to perhaps mention that agra only grants sepoy going to age 2, otherwise its gurkha (Although age 2 is prob the most common use). Also most ships come with a vill but not all. And I think you mean 'distributivism'. GJ

ESO:ChrisTheMean
N3O Clan Website
Of myChinese Confucian Confusion FF MarneusCalgar said, "It sounds like an 70's kung-fu movie." And it is.

[This message has been edited by ChrisTheMean (edited 01-30-2010 @ 00:36 AM).]

posted 01-30-10 08:59 AM EDT (US)     6 / 23  
I always thought it was "distrivibutism"

Nice OP guide Sunil

One thing I've wondered about though, is how useful the Agra Fort's attack really is? I mean it's only 25 attack (less than an outpost), and you can't really kill anything with that (except strelets) before they just run away

The Sepoys are nice though.

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[This message has been edited by No_nickname (edited 01-30-2010 @ 09:04 AM).]

posted 01-30-10 09:05 AM EDT (US)     7 / 23  
Agra attack is annoying but doesn't really hurt, that's all. I'd still put units in scatter mode though. But it's fun to abuse the splash of agra and monks so that they also attack treasure guardians, just ask bart :P
posted 01-30-10 01:53 PM EDT (US)     8 / 23  
One thing I've wondered about though, is how useful the Agra Fort's attack really is? I mean it's only 25 attack (less than an outpost), and you can't really kill anything with that (except strelets) before they just run away
Ya, agra fort attack isn't that strong, but remember it also has 5 K HP, so even the small 25 attack with 3 area damage can potentially do quite a bit of damage if someone tries to take down the agra.
Also IMO part of it is psychological as well, it just looks so damn big

QUACK
posted 01-30-10 02:15 PM EDT (US)     9 / 23  
Agrafort has a damagecap of 50, so it does 50 damage but it spreads out over multiple units.

I don't think 50 damage is bad for a colonial building

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posted 01-30-10 02:40 PM EDT (US)     10 / 23  
Apart from the blob of hit points, yeah, Agra is kind of meh. The big feature is that you get to start building units the instant you reach Colonial. If you're not trying to pull off a rush, other wonders are better.

This is a very good guide, btw., because India definitely has a lot more potential than the 10/10. Well written.
posted 01-30-10 03:55 PM EDT (US)     11 / 23  
ive seen this guide before,but i cant figure out where....Nice write up sunil
edit:this is at the TE site isnt it?

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One day as I sat musing,alone and melancholy without a friend,there came a voice out of gloom saying'Cheer Up,things might be worse.'And sure enough,things got worse.

[This message has been edited by morgoth93 (edited 01-30-2010 @ 03:57 PM).]

posted 01-30-10 06:12 PM EDT (US)     12 / 23  
very nice, i may try india after reading this

that would complete my trifectum of OP civs haha

france dutch india

hooray for abusing imbalances!
posted 01-30-10 06:30 PM EDT (US)     13 / 23  
somehow i always fail with india

SUNIL IS NUB!!!

Battle.net:Bart (227)
ESO:Bart331
posted 01-30-10 06:56 PM EDT (US)     14 / 23  
Is schildpad's comment in my sig still true of Elephants? I know I like having a Man Siege Ele along with 4 or so other siege eles, but how about mahouts? Howdahs?

Crunkatog on ESO
Bart331 balance suggestion: aztec: remove civ
Voltiguer: Ender, Sioux in 1.04 will be a top civ, no matter how many layers of Sioux goggles you put on
schildpad on Elephants: ...their mansabdar unit sucks so hard it looks like a black hole
Crunkatog on Steam.
posted 01-30-10 10:11 PM EDT (US)     15 / 23  
Is schildpad's comment in my sig still true of Elephants? I know I like having a Man Siege Ele along with 4 or so other siege eles, but how about mahouts? Howdahs?
Yes, personally I would never get a mansabdar elephant in supremacy game, for example the mansabdar mahout takes up a full 14 population as well as 1000+ resources. Only time I could see it being used is in treaty where you can send the elephant population lowering card.
Eles in general are not that widely used in supremacy TBH. Most of the time I will just use them from shipments, and will rarely make more than a few from caravensi the entire game.
ive seen this guide before,but i cant figure out where....Nice write up sunil
edit:this is at the TE site isnt it?
Yes TE gets the OP guides before HG ♥
Apart from the blob of hit points, yeah, Agra is kind of meh. The big feature is that you get to start building units the instant you reach Colonial. If you're not trying to pull off a rush, other wonders are better.
Even though it seems a bit weak it is like getting a free rax+OP outpost IMMEDIATELY upon aging to colonial, which other civ gets that?
Even on TAD FanPatch where agra went to 4K HP, it can still be used for a contain/rush (see agra contain build).
Indeed the fact that it is a free outpost/rax in one is a major plus about it.
Another major bonus is that it grants a HUGE LOS and HUGE map control due to its vast size.

QUACK
posted 01-31-10 08:16 AM EDT (US)     16 / 23  
Very nice Sunil!

The rec games was really entertaining too! Congrat and thx!


How about the special India xp collecting with herdables?

Is it worth to build a sacred field on maps like Texas, Deccan or Araucania? -Shure there is no time for that in a rush, but in the other builds.
posted 02-01-10 07:54 PM EDT (US)     17 / 23  
Very nice Sunil!

The rec games was really entertaining too! Congrat and thx!
glad you liked it
How about the special India xp collecting with herdables?

Is it worth to build a sacred field on maps like Texas, Deccan or Araucania? -Shure there is no time for that in a rush, but in the other builds.
IMO it's not really worth it to build on maps such as that. A sacred field is 200 wood. A tradepost is 200 wood on RE.

Comparing the xp generation rates of TP and sacred field, you're most of the time better off just taking a TP if you want xp and gathering the herdables without sacred field. I would only make a sacred field if you have your full 10 herdables ready to gather and would definitely not recommend doing so early game. Preferably later on, perhaps using some wood from your 600 wood age 2 shipment.
However I always will take a consulate, barracks, stable, market+upgrades over a sacred field or TP with india

QUACK
posted 02-01-10 08:31 PM EDT (US)     18 / 23  
I would MAYBE contemplate building a sacred field during transition on Painted Desert or Mongolia if I had a full complement of cattle. Other than that, no. Most games I don't bother with a Sacred Field at all. Early on, I need the resources for economy and troops, and later, my troops are supplying the bulk of my XP, via bounty.
posted 02-01-10 09:11 PM EDT (US)     19 / 23  
I've never made a sacred field... ever

DISTISOP
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posted 02-02-10 02:47 PM EDT (US)     20 / 23  
nice guide.

I just started learning india myself, overall would you say that it's best to play aggresively or reactively, ie should i try to set the agenda or counter more. The reason i ask is because of the mansabdar units- if i have a good all round balanced army can i scout and get the mansabdar that counters any imbalance that my opponent has. Or is it best to try to force it in colonial, i know 10/10 is good but how strong are the other strats comparatively?
posted 02-02-10 05:25 PM EDT (US)     21 / 23  
I just started learning india myself, overall would you say that it's best to play aggresively or reactively, ie should i try to set the agenda or counter more. The reason i ask is because of the mansabdar units- if i have a good all round balanced army can i scout and get the mansabdar that counters any imbalance that my opponent has. Or is it best to try to force it in colonial, i know 10/10 is good but how strong are the other strats comparatively?
The nice part about india unlike other strong rush civs such as iroquois is that India also has a pretty nice boom. Therefore you can have a multitude of options. If you are playing on RE patch there really is no good reason to not 10/10 rush though however because it's just that lame lol. On FanPatch (yay!) there are many options available since agra isn't as dominating.

QUACK
posted 02-03-10 05:47 PM EDT (US)     22 / 23  
I play for XP (my goal playing the game used to be reaching Level 50 with every civ; I've finally succeeded), so I love Sacred Fields.
posted 02-14-10 04:55 PM EDT (US)     23 / 23  
Nice guide sunil.
Perhaps I will learn something besides a highly improvised 10/10
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