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Topic Subject: Gods info
posted 05-04-00 12:50 ET (US)   
Note: post has been corrected regarding the rate that festival effects wear off

Hi all,

I've been experimenting with how to appease the gods and get those juicy major blessings. I now know how to manipulate divine favor so I get a major blessing (almost) every time, and I can get a single minor blessing even without a festival square! Want to learn how?

First, let me present the degrees of divine favor, from highest to lowest, and the population to shrine ratio required to achieve that rating (given for a local deity; double the shrine count for patron deity):

benevolent
approving
sympathetic
congenial ---------- less than 300
amiable ------------- 300 to 350
apathetic ---------- 350 to 408
displeased --------- 408 to 490
resentful ----------- 490 to 522
angry --------------- 522 to 625
furious -------------- 625 to I'm not sure
enraged ------------ Don't go there!

In other words, if you want to keep the a particular local god amiable towards you, you want at least one shrine for every 350 people.

Two things modify this table; the time since the last festival, and the population of your city.

A festival increases a god's favor by three ranks (e.g. from amiable to approving), but this effect wears off at the rate of one rank per year. (More or less: If the god is displeased or worse, the rate is one rank in the first 11 months and per 10 months thereafter; if the god is happy, it is once in the first 13 months, and per 10 months thereafter.)

If your population is 400 or below, the gods will be apathetic towards you. No matter how many or how few shrines, temples, or festivals you have, they will be apathetic.

With 400 to 450 people you can change their mood one place either direction; i.e. from amiable to displeased. With 450 to 500 you can move them two places, and so on until you get the full range of divine emotions with 650 or more people. When a god's mood reaches a high (or low) at least two steps away from apathetic, you start to accumulate ankhs (or lightning bolts!).

At the beginning of the scenario the game thinks that a festival has just been celebrated for all the gods. You won't notice this because your population is too low for the gods to be other than apathetic. But if you get your population high enough fast enough, and have enough shrines, you can curry enough divine favor to get a minor blessing near the end of that first year, even without a festival square.

The game tends to give more minor blessings than major blessings. There's a critical time about a year after a festival when the game will try to give you a blessing; if the god's favor is benevolent or approving, (or even sympathetic) and you have a few little ankhs, you'll get a spontaneous minor blessing instead of a bigger one a few months later.

What you need to do to avoid this is set up a little stub of road with an architect's post and some shrines. Counting the shrines on this road, you should reach "congenial" favor- without them, your appeasement level should be apathetic (or worse). If you have just had a blessing, you want to disconnect enough shrines to make your favor drop (a shrine more than 2 squares away from a road square doesn't count towards the city total). Let it drop to apathetic; don't wait too long, or the lack of architect coverage will make them collapse! Also, you don't need to accumulate lightning bolts- apathetic is low enough.

When the favor has dropped to apathetic, rebuild the road and let your favor start to accumulate. The game is unwilling to grant a spontaneous blessing more than a year or so after a festival, so if the favor doesn't reach minor blessing status until 16 or 17 months have passed, you are safe; the little blue ankhs won't be wasted. When you have four blue ankhs and the god is at least sympathetic, call a common festival. If you are too hasty, you might get a minor blessing anyway. If your favor didn't climb fast enough you might end up with a benevolent favor rating and five blue ankhs, and no blessing; no problem, just hold another one and it will be along within four or five months of the second festival.

It is very difficult to get more than one major blessing from a god in a given two year period. With a little practice you should be able to get two every five years, though. And if you are juggling two or three gods, you'll be maxing out on festivals anyway.

Enjoy!

--Jimhotep


[This message has been edited by Jimhotep (edited 05-04-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Jimhotep (edited 05-04-2000).]

Replies:
posted 05-04-00 16:28 ET (US)     1 / 16  
Another fine essay, Jimhotep
A
ngel
J
ahakemhotep
Eyrie, Pharaoh Heaven, Caesar 3 Heaven
Have you consulted the Pharaoh FAQs today?

------------------
Homage to thee, Osiris, Lord of Eternity, King of the Gods, whose names are manifold, whose forms are holy, thou being of hidden form in the temples, whose Ka is holy."
-- Book of the Dead (1240 BC)

posted 05-04-00 21:55 ET (US)     2 / 16  
First rate stuff, Jimhotep.

Is it your experience that ankhs/lightning bolts accumulate very slowly at the congenial and resentful levels? I've gone for at least a few years in each of these cases without seeing even the beginnings of divine activity.

Are you referring to Grand festivals as moving sentiment by 3 levels? This would imply lavish=2 levels and common=1 level, but I'm not sure if this is accurate.

-- JWorth

posted 05-04-00 23:26 ET (US)     3 / 16  
JWorth,

My test map has no beer, so I've just been using common and lavish festivals. The lavish festivals give a bigger initial boost, but the level of shrine coverage quickly eliminates the difference between the two degrees of festival.

A massive number of shrines will make the gods benevolent in the first 13 months, approving in the ten months after that, sympathetic in the 10 months after that, and then congenial. (Note- I corrected my original post to reflect this rate of deterioration).

Sentiment can change within a month, and can sometimes change two (after a festival, say). Within the first year, sentiment climbs about one step per month- I didn't check the rates after the first year, but certainly the ankhs didn't accumulate very quickly in the second year(once every four months, generally).

--Jimhotep

[This message has been edited by Jimhotep (edited 05-04-2000).]

posted 05-04-00 23:43 ET (US)     4 / 16  
Hmmm.

Further refinements of my "get big blessing" technique: the method I described requires a light touch, and sometimes doesn't work (I think there are random number generators involved). Of particular note is the fact that lavish festivals are much more reliable than common ones!

Anyway, the following method seems easier and more reliable:

1. Have the God fully appeased; at least one shrine (or equivalent) per 300 people.

2. Go to step 3 after a blessing has been received (of whatever size) or a festival has been called.

3. Leave your shrines as they are; let sentiment improve normally, and little ankhs accumulate. Within a year you will likely see a minor blessing. This is OK. (The drop in sentiment that a minor blessing causes is equivalent to disconnecting your shrines for a time; and you don't need to micromanage to do it!)

4. Keep an eye on the calendar, and on the ankhs. The festival which triggers the major blessing must take place before month 23. If you forget, or if there are not enough ankhs, a common festival taking place after month 23 will sometimes give you a benevolent rating and five ankhs- a second common festival will then get you your major blessing.

5. A lavish festival will work with three (or more) ankhs if called in months 17 to 19- but not in month 20. A common festival with four ankhs will usually work, but the timing is critical; call it in month 20 (or early in 21) and hope for the best.

If anyone has any good rules of thumb for getting lots of major blessings, please share them!

--Jimhotep

[This message has been edited by Jimhotep (edited 05-04-2000).]

posted 05-05-00 05:09 ET (US)     5 / 16  
Major blessings? I do this only when Bastet is available:

Give her the best of everything and when she's very happy, i.e. benevolent with blue ankhs, throw her a festival and then she will throw a festival for other gods and the other gods will all heap you with blessings. Of course, the other gods' rating of you must be relatively high for it to work. After the first one or two time you do this, you will need only to throw festivals to Bast to make the other gods blees you as well.
Da Pharaoher
From the Field of Reeds

posted 05-05-00 08:47 ET (US)     6 / 16  
Two things I've noticed (which may or may not be relevant):

-- While 4 temples seem to be equal to 2 temples + 4 shrines in generating contentment, over time 1 temple + 6 shrines seems to be superior to 8 shrines. Each god seems to want at least one temple.

-- I've seen situations (without festival squares) in which gods had different reactions to identical shrine/temple coverages. I haven't tested this thoroughly, and the only time I'm absolutely positive I've seen this was on a test map with Osiris as a local god but no flood plain -- and Osiris showered me with curses, despite exactly the same, entirely adequate coverage that the other local gods received (who were kept amiable).

posted 05-05-00 10:09 ET (US)     7 / 16  
Perhaps because it was a local god? I think only Patron Gods needed extra attention, but maybe not...
Da Pharaoher
From the Field of Reeds
posted 05-05-00 14:33 ET (US)     8 / 16  
JWorth: Unless I am building a luxury block, I never build temples to the local Gods. They seem to stay quite satisified with shrines provided they get enough of them.

I've also built Temple Complexes dedicated to a local God and the Patron God stayed happy as long as it got it's fair share of Temples/shrines

posted 05-05-00 17:30 ET (US)     9 / 16  
JWorth,

Your little adventure with Osiris sounds like the kind of weirdness which occasionally turns up in the game. Today I was testing wages and taxes on the Unreliant Custom map, and for some reason my favor rate kept returning to 50. I'd get a big boost from Ra and it would go to 65, but then it would quickly drop back down.

When I built a mansion and gave gifts, the game kept saying that it was "0 months since your last gift," no matter how many years would go by.

Go figure!

--Jimhotep

posted 05-05-00 17:42 ET (US)     10 / 16  
Jimhotep,
In Caesar III, Favor frequently resets to 50 in custom maps that don't have a Favor requirement. I suppose it's the same with Kingdom in Pharaoh.

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 05-05-2000).]

posted 05-05-00 18:17 ET (US)     11 / 16  
Grumpus,

Interesting, we seem to get different results. I often don't bother with festival squares/festivals; perhaps this explains the difference? On several occasions I've raised a persistently unhappy god (with no temples but theoretically ample shrine coverage) up to amiable/congenial by deleting two shrines and replacing with a temple. Strange...

JimHotep,

The game definately has some quirks, and I haven't tried to repeat the disgruntled Osiris experiment (perhaps Osiris routine was confused by absence of floods/floodplain on the test map...). I think Brugle has the explanation for your KR quirks, though (I've seen this happen with open-play custom Pharaoh maps).

-- JWorth

[This message has been edited by JWorth (edited 05-05-2000).]

posted 05-05-00 19:49 ET (US)     12 / 16  
JWorth:

It could be the festivals. I make a practice of holding one for the Patron God at the beginning of the game, and then holding more festivals for the various gods as often as I can.

posted 09-28-01 04:29 ET (US)     13 / 16  
how can u get a construction blessing?
posted 09-28-01 07:46 ET (US)     14 / 16  
Welcome to Pharaoh Heaven queen_kate

I presume you mean the monument speed-up blessing. If you have Cleopatra installed and this turned on (under options) then whenever you get any Gods blessing there is a 50/50 chance that it will be a speed-up blessing rather than their normal blessing. So to get one you need to follow the general guide to getting blessings mentioned earlier in this thread, and then hope you get the speed-up blessing rather than the normal one.

posted 09-28-01 08:31 ET (US)     15 / 16  
i think you need also the service pack for cleopatra to get this option.
posted 09-28-01 10:24 ET (US)     16 / 16  
The speed-up blessing option is available in Cleopatra even if you don't have the patch installed. However, installing the patch is highly recommended as it fixes a bug that can occur when you dispatch burial goods. You can download the Cleo patch from Impressions site
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