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Topic Subject: 5 minutes housing blocks. Good up to Fancy Residence
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posted 05-12-01 00:19 ET (US)   
So you've been playing pharaoh for a while now, and have heard all this mumbo jumbo about housing blocks. What are they? What do they do? How can I build one? In this post I'd like to address these questions with my insights and opinions on the game.

What are housing blocks?
Housing Blocks refer a closed looped road, with few intersections. I like to keep mine down to 8 or less choices for my walkers. They need to be a closed loop, so only destination walkers, can get in or out.

What do they do?
In a nutshell, housing blocks give you control, and stability. Control, in that YOU can decide when to upgrade them, you get to decide what food they buy. There's no random factors here. The stability is that all the walkers that supply, and are necessary to upgrade the housing, walk that closed loop. They cannot escape. Your houses, if you can produce the goods, will be VERY stable.


Please check the next message, for How do I build one, as it will contain glphy, illustrating a quick and painless method to housing blocks.

Replies:
posted 05-12-01 00:20 ET (US)     1 / 47  
How do I build one?

Building a housing block can be VERY easy, if you just answer a few questions, and stick to a few rules.

Questions:
What level does this block need to improve too?
How much space do I have to build it?
Do I need worker access on all sides?

Rules:
1.Almost all buildings that supply and provide for your block will be built in the center area, unless you have tons of space in which case extra houses could be build (see rule #3).
2.The inside road loop can only be 52 tiles long. I prefer 50 for safe measure. (from other threads you should know this is the max safe distance for a water carrier)
3. Only build what you need, don't over do it.

Let's explain rule #3 a bit. Don't go laying down the roads, putting in some basic services, and then put in all your housing. This does 2 things to you. Can create massive unemployment, and not all of your houses will develop 2x2 (which is optimal). When laying houses down i will alway's leave a 2x2 space, for later expansion.

IE.

HouseHouse HouseHouse HouseHouse
HouseHouse HouseHouse HouseHouse

Legend


What this acomplishes, is of course, you get all 2x2 housing, and it will help keep the medium age range (the working age) of your population, to a more average number. Your unemployment won't be peaking, and falling all the time, when you haven't added or removed any housing. *** very important in those LOOOOOONG missions ***

So now that's covered, let's jump into it.

Okay, You've started the mission, and you need to get some housing in to provide workers for your farms. (With my method, if you want to plan out how many workers you'll need for x number of farms, be my guest. I'll just stick to winging this part. I'm not a big number cruncher) These houses don't need to evole all that far, and you decide your going to only give them pottery, and no beer. Also, your space to build this housing is is limited by 2 factors. Access to water, and a small building space.

Step 1: Figure out how many squares (i think in terms of square meters, dunno why, but 1 meter = 1 square) You need in your middle loop. For our example, we would need 1 temple, 1 bazzar, 1 water carrier, a firehouse, architect, and because I belive in good health, a dentist, apocethary, and physician. Of course, gotta get taxes, so you'll need a tax collecter, and they will want some entertainment, so a jugglers booth or 2 would be important. A police man could be prudent in some cases, but I usually omit him. I believe that any housing that isn't brown, won't generate any thieves. So this works out to 31, with 2 jugglers. I need to have a 31 square meters in my inner loop. I find that inner loops work well with 4 5 or 6 squares. 31 being a prime number, has some problems, but ohwell. More statues/gardens is alway's nice, or well, i guess I didn't really need a dentist here. Which ever will fit best into your space. So let's assume that you have very little space, (remember, you need to have some work camps here as well, eh) enough for a block, but it has to be a 4 space block, but can have 3 sides to be worker access. Let me just illustrate for a second.

4 space block:


Legend
5 space block:

Legend

6 space block:


Legend

Neeless to say, these can be oriented east-west, or north-south, whatever you need.


So here's the final product:

Ptah TempleJuggle platform
Fire Warden
Architect
PhysicianTax Collector
Dentist Water Supply
Bazaar
ApothecaryJuggle platform

Legend

As you can see, all the required industries fit very snugly, with 1 left over square. Whee! There's no set way to do it, just make them fit properly. With practice, you should have no problem. The #1 thing to remember here tho, is that your bazzar needs to be facing the, or one of the, exits (which is roadblocked of course). In the example, say the farmland is to the right side, and there's some mountains on the left (no worker access road there), and your docks are a ways to the south, say, oh.. 30-40 "squares". Now that you kind of have a mental picture, we need to add roads. We know that the employment walkers only need to pass within 2 squares of some housing, to be able to get workers from it. This is why we build all the services on the inside of our loop, that way, the houses can be nicely on the outside, and provide excellent access to your industries! So using our example, and the described scenario, our housing block would now look like this:

HouseHouse
HouseHouse HouseHouse
HouseHouse FarmFarmFarmFarm
Ptah TempleJuggle platform
Fire Warden
ArchitectHouseHouse Work Camp FarmFarmFarm
PhysicianTax CollectorHouseHouse
Dentist Water Supply
BazaarHouseHouse FarmFarm
ApothecaryJuggle platformHouseHouse
HouseHouse HouseHouse
HouseHouse HouseHouse
Architect
Fire Warden
Granary

Legend

Now, true, this isn't much housing at the moment. But you don't need much either. As it get's filled up, hopefully developing into 2x2 housing, you add more housing into it. Of course, that nasty dirty work camp there is going to affect those houses, so definatly build something in that 1 blank spot, to help shield the house. Note: some buildings are worse than others. Housing should alway's be kept futher away from graneries, conservatories, shipwrights, all the construction guilds, dance schools. Probably some others, please check here for the effect on desirability of the different buildings. Eventually, your housing block will look something like this:

HouseHouseApartmentApartment
HouseHouseApartment
FarmFarmFarmFarm
Ptah TempleJuggle platformHouseHouse
Fire WardenHouseHouse
ArchitectApartmentWork Camp FarmFarmFarm
PhysicianTax Collector
HouseHouse
Dentist Water SupplyHouseHouse
BazaarApartment FarmFarm
ApothecaryJuggle platformWork Camp
HouseHouse
HouseHouse ApartmentHouseHouse
HouseHouse
Architect
Fire Warden
Granary

Legend

And will continue upgrading. ** Remember ** Set your bazzaar to only buy what you want it to buy. Don't let your houses just get what they want, try and control them, for some stability.

That's it for this first installment. I've found this message is huge (sorry for all the glyphy), and it's time for me to go sleep. I will Finish up what i was going to say tommorrow, in the next installment of the 5 minute guide to housing blocks

Zorkk

[This message has been edited by Zorkk (edited 05-12-2001 @ 01:36 AM).]

posted 05-12-01 04:01 ET (US)     2 / 47  
Hey,
that's very nice! Thanks for a good post, I'm eagerly waiting for the next part. I just printed it out so that I can study it in peace.

I'm very impressed about the well-known housing blocks that I've seen, and I've been thinking of designing my own (someday). Maybe with a help like your posts, I can get it done.

posted 05-12-01 16:04 ET (US)     3 / 47  
Nefermenu: Thank you very much for your kind words, and I truly hope my "plan" helps you with the game =)

Now begins the 2nd installment:

So now you've learned how to setup a quick and simple block. No frills, no strings, just good functionality. Let's just do a quick recap here.

-All supply buildings for your housing must be on the inside
-All the housing should be on the outside
-Your entrance/exit to the block can be anywhere, or you can have more than 1. (I prefer more than 1, I'll explain why later)
-Inner road loop can not be any more than 52 tiles.
-Industry can get labour from up to 4 sides.

Today, I'd like to show you how to build a housing block, which will provide access to workers from all 4 sides. Here's the scenario. Your on the same map as the previous example, tho now we're going to build up our dock area and import/export industry(remember I said the docks were like 30-40 squares to the south). For this example, space is not an issue, there is tons available, and there is plenty of water supply. I've decided, that this block will be a major worker supply to my industries, and I'm going to upgrade it as far as possible. Up to fancy residence. To get there we need to have: Water Supply, Market, access to 2 gods, Physician, Courthouse, Scribal School, Dentist and we need to supply our people with 2 types of food, pottery, beer, and linen. WOW. Until you type it out, you don't really realize that that's just about everything in the game. Of course, to get up there, you also need to have good access to entertainment. (45 points worth) All of this information I grabbed from the Housing Levels page here on PH.

To start, I throw down the roads, and then put in some housing. Now, when I throw down roads, I don't actually just put them down. Our main concern here is the coast, and access to the dock, and having enuf space between that and the houses for some storage yards, perhaps even some industry. Other industries can be to the north or south, or west of your block. So what I do is start off with the dock. Ya know your gonna need it, it can only be in certain locations, so put it down first. Now, to have effect trade, you need a large number of storage yards around that dock. I prefer (especially on missions with Ptah) to have 1 storage yard by the dock for each type of good that your importing and exporting. The reason for this, especially if you have to import a raw material to make a finished good, is it helps keep all your industries busy. I have been able to supply, and keep running abut 8-9 industries off of 1 storage yard supplying the raw materials. Any more than that, and you start seeing industries without any raw materials. (even with 8 or 9, you will sometimes have some problems suppling the raw materials damn I love Ptah!) Let's say, for our example, that we need to import barley for our beer, and reeds for papyrus (we need some for the scibal school, to get FR, and also an export). So now that we have a basic plan, and idea on what's happening, let's start building. I would start this block like this:

Storage Yard
ArchitectFire WardenDock

Legend

As you can see, the inner road loop is 52 tiles long, a bit longer than I like, but You can go up to that. If you wanted too, you could make it longer, but would have to provide a 2nd water carrier, and a 2nd baazar, and they would have to be placed at opposite ends of your loops. As it is tho, I have found that you don't need a loop bigger than 52. If you think you need to do it, to get more housing, try first off, evolving other housing blocks, if you can. Or thinking about building another housing block somewhere else, that needs access to workers. So after laying down some roads roads like that, I'd go and add in the houses, and industries. With a configuartion like this, it's very easy to add industries, have them supplied with labour with no troubles. I'm going to add in the pottery industry on top, and the beer industry underneath.
Of course before adding the industries in, you'll want to put in some beginning housing like the first example, and put more in as it fills up to 2x2. So when your done, your block should look similar to this:

Fire WardenArchitect Fire WardenArchitect
GranaryPotterPotterPotterPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker
PotterPotterPotterPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker Waterlift
Storage Yard
Potter Potter PapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker Waterlift
Waterlift
ApartmentApartmentHouseHouseApartmentHouseHouseApartment HouseHouseApartmentHouseHouse Storage YardWaterlift
HouseHouseHouseHouse HouseHouseHouseHouseApartment
HouseHouse
HouseHouse Bastet Temple BazaarPtah TemplePhysician Apartment Storage Yard
Apothecary
Fire Warden Tax Collector ArchitectFire WardenDock
ArchitectCourthouse Osiris Temple
ApartmentDentist Water Supply Storage Yard
Juggle platform
ApartmentApartment
HouseHouseApartment ApartmentHouseHouseApartmentHouseHouseApartmentHouseHouse Storage Yard
HouseHouse HouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouse
BreweryBreweryBreweryBrewery
BreweryBreweryBreweryBreweryBrewery
Fire WardenArchitect

Legend
Note:The water lifts are there to represent the clay diggers.

Please remember when you look at this, that it's fairly rough. I'm just trying to show what I think is a really good way to build your cities, and make a functional housing block anywhere. You have noticed by now, that i've made 4 entrance/exits into this loop. This is overkill, I wanted to do it, to show you that it doesn't matter where you put the road(s) that connect the inner ring to the outside. Put it, or them where it fits best with your current road layout. You can see, i've been able to stuff in a lot of industry (well I think it's a lot), and there's still plenty room for more. Keep in mind tho, that each map is different, and sometimes you will have lots of space, other times you will have no space at all. That's the whole point to this posting tho. I want you to be able to make a block that will fit into whatever space you need or have. Tthis is not a set block it's just an example! don't go and just copy that above block and use it all over the place. Use my explaination to know how housing blocks work, because then you will be able to make your own.

Now, I'm sure you can all see that big wide open space in the middle there. You can put whatever tickles your fancy in there. More housing, if you need workers, a Palace, or a mansion could fit well in there. Use your imagination. You won't have that open space on every block you build, it all depends on the size you've decided to build, and what not.

I bet some of you have also noticed, that I have left out pretty much all entertainment, except for that one little juggler stand. Not to worry, I'm going to add that next here. To get a house up to fancy residence, I believe it does need to get passed by dancers. Please see the next reply for the entertainment information.

[This message has been edited by Zorkk (edited 05-12-2001 @ 06:03 PM).]

posted 05-12-01 17:31 ET (US)     4 / 47  
Entertainment:

To get these houses up to fancy residence, your definatly going to need some entertainment. Now, I myself don't like culture parks, I feel that it should all be worked into your city. The beautiful thing about my system here, is that because all the houses are within 2 squares of the worker road, most of the entertainment can be built outside your block, as the walkers from the entertainment venues and schools will happily walk along the outside road, and give your houses the proper entertainment points. If your like me, then you like to have "perfect" entertainment coverage. With this system, there's almost alay's room for another bandstand, or pavillion somewhere. More is better, as they provide both beautification, and entertainment. As a secondary bonus, if your short on jobs (major unemployment), just add more entertainment! Dance schools, pavillions and bandstands all take 10+ employee's, and the other entertainment venue's are just under that. I think they're another good solution to keeping down unemployment. So here's what your block, could look like:

Fire WardenArchitect Fire WardenArchitect
DanceschoolGranaryPotterPotterPotterPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker
PotterPotterPotterPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker Waterlift
Storage Yard
Juggler School PotterMusic platformPotterMusic platformDance platformPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker Waterlift
Juggle platform
Waterlift
Juggle platform
ApartmentApartmentHouseHouseApartmentHouseHouseApartment HouseHouseApartmentHouseHouse Storage YardWaterlift
HouseHouseHouseHouse HouseHouseHouseHouseApartment
HouseHouse
HouseHouse Bastet TempleCity PalaceBazaarPtah TemplePhysician Apartment Storage Yard
Music platform Apothecary
Fire Warden Tax Collector Music platformJuggle platform ArchitectFire WardenDock
Juggle platform ArchitectCourthouse Osiris Temple
ApartmentDentist Water Supply Dance platform Storage Yard
Juggle platform
ApartmentApartment
HouseHouseApartmentApartmentHouseHouseApartmentHouseHouseApartmentHouseHouse Storage Yard
HouseHouseMusic platformHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouse Dance platform
Juggle platform
ConservatoryFire WardenArchitect BreweryBreweryBreweryBreweryMusic platformJuggle platform
BreweryBreweryBreweryBreweryBrewery
Fire WardenArchitect

Legend

Now, I've really gone overboard with the entertainment, to try and show you possible configurations you can use to get them in. Notice along the top row there. I actually didn't plan that very well, but it does work. There should be little traffic on that pavillion road going into the block, so it should not screw up any random walkers. So we're really close to done her. I've left out the beautification, so as to make it easier to see the important parts, but this post can't be complete until I get to the end. Please continue onto the next message, to see the completed block. I'm going to add in some weavers, because we will need linen to upgrade the block fully.

[This message has been edited by Zorkk (edited 05-12-2001 @ 10:06 PM).]

posted 05-12-01 17:57 ET (US)     5 / 47  
Beautification

Even tho I'm leaving this to the end, YOU shouldn't. Statues, gardens, plazas, Shrines, all need to be added as necessary to get your housing to improve to the next level. To get these houses all the way up to fancy residence levels, your going to have to put in as much beautification as possible. Especially when your housing backs onto industry. Peronally, I have a thing for shrines, so in my city you will see lots of them. One reason is that I used to think that shines gave more desirability points than statues or gardens, but they don't. But there's a 2nd good reason for using shrines, they help to keep the gods happy. Again, i don't need to use religon parks in my cities, becaue of all the shrines I like to use.

So here it is!

Fire WardenArchitect Fire WardenArchitect
DanceschoolGranaryPotterPotterPotterPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker
PotterPotterPotterPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker Waterlift
Storage Yard
Juggler School PotterMusic platformPotterMusic platformDance platformPapyrusmakerPapyrusmakerPapyrusmaker Waterlift
Juggle platform
Waterlift
ShrineShrineShrineShrineShrineShrineJuggle platformShrineShrine
ApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartment Storage YardWaterlift
ShrineApartment
ApartmentShrine
Shrine Bastet TempleCity PalaceBazaarPtah TemplePhysician Apartment Storage Yard
Music platformApothecary Shrine
Fire Warden Tax CollectorMusic platformJuggle platform ArchitectFire WardenDock
Juggle platformArchitectCourthouse Osiris Temple
ApartmentDentist Water SupplyDance platform Storage Yard
ShrineJuggle platform Shrine
ApartmentApartmentShrine
ShrineHouseHouseApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartment Storage Yard
HouseHouseMusic platformDance platform
ShrineShrineShrineJuggle platformShrineShrineShrineShrineShrineShrine
ConservatoryFire WardenArchitectStorage YardWeaverWeaverWeaverBreweryBreweryBreweryBreweryMusic platformJuggle platform
WeaverWeaverWeaverBreweryBreweryBreweryBreweryBrewery
Fire WardenArchitect

Legend


So there it is. I'm going to finish up with one last post, talking about adapting. Since it's an important part of my blocks/method.

posted 05-12-01 18:31 ET (US)     6 / 47  
Very impressive Zorkk i'm sure informative posts like these are appreciated by all standards keep up the good work

The master of making easy look hard ---- What's wrong with Scooby Doo boxers?
Cockfosters visitor via a stunt cannon ---- Fan of the Great Cornholio Tee shirt dance
Coyote ugly beauty, parrott mangler & all round good egg ---- Have leather pants will travel
posted 05-13-01 20:38 ET (US)     7 / 47  
Zorkk,
A shrine raises desirability more than a garden or small statue. A 2x2 (or 3x3) block of shrines raises desirability more than a medium (or large) statue in adjacent tiles, but less than the statue in some tiles that are a moderate distance away.
posted 05-13-01 23:47 ET (US)     8 / 47  
To add to what Brugle has said, not only do temples have a higher desirability (+4) than small statues (+3) or gardens (+3), but they also have a greater range. That means that shrines, with a range of 4, spread their desirability further than small statues or gardens that have a range of 3.

Below is a desirability range chart for a SHrine:

+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1
+1 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +3 +3 +3 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +4 +4 +4 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +4 SH +4 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +4 +4 +4 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +3 +3 +3 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +1
+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1

Below is a desirability range chart for a Small Statue(SS) or Garden:

+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1
+1 +2 +2 +2+2 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +3 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 SS +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +3 +3 +3 +2 +1
+1 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +1
+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1

[This message has been edited by VitruviusAIA (edited 05-13-2001 @ 11:48 PM).]

posted 05-15-01 19:12 ET (US)     9 / 47  
Thanks for the info about the shrines! So I wasn't wrong originally. If you check out just the building pages here on Pharaoh Heaven, it shows the effect on desirability, and shrines, statues, gardens, jugglers booths, all show as 1 green bit. That's what i was going by

As promised, here is the final installment of my 5 minute housing blocks. After re-reading my previous posts, I really should just rename this to the 30 minute guide to your own housing blocks. It's amazing what happens once you start typing. I hope that at least 1 person out there is finding this information useful, and is able to understand it!!! Even if no one is, it's not going to stop me from finishing! HAH! So let's begin.

Adaptation

Being able to adapt to whatever scenario/mission your on is a critical part of Pharaoh. As you know, each mission has it's own different map, and even my blocks won't fit there. So this calls for some necessary adapting. Some people will just build some pick up housing, in an industrial area, to make sure they can get workers to those hard to reach places. I myself, HATE doing that. Those houses look terrible IMHO. So what can you do? In this segment, I will describe a few scenarios, and then recommend what I think is the best way to work around those situations. But first, let's go back to messages one. When i defined housing blocks, I said:

Quote:
Housing Blocks refer to a closed, looped road...

Now, let me ask you, is this a close road?

Apartment ApartmentPhysicianApartment
ApothecaryDentist
BazaarPtah TempleFire WardenArchitectWater Supply

Legend

Or how about this???

Ra Temple
PhysicianApartmentHouseHouseApartment
HouseHouse
Juggle platformFire WardenArchitectDentistApothecary BazaarWater Supply

Legend

The answer is they both are. To elaborate on the definition of housing blocks, a closed, looped road, is any road section, that random walkers are caught in. ie: they have to can not go outside the boundries you have set for them. With this expanded definition, you can do some really great things.

Take for example, on thos maps where the gold mines, or the gem mines are REALLY far away from any water supply. How would you get them supplied with employees?? Well, using our new, expanded definition of Housing Blocks, we could do something like this:

Apartment Water Supply
Apartment

Legend

As long as a straight road is 52 squares or less (i prefer 50 for safety) Then you have yerself a closed loop, or housing block. You can then use normal procedure to get workers to those industries, like this:

MineMineMine
MineMineMine
Apartment
Apartment

Legend


As you can see, it's a long walk, but the industries should all get supplied with workers without too much problem.

So I think this about covers it. On a final note, I'd just like to say Don't get stuck using just one or two blocks! In this post I've tried to provide you with the all the information you need to be able to setup a block for any situation. Go ahead, give it a try, play around some! I used to have just 1 standard block that I used (a modified grumpus block) and I got through just about the whole game with it. But man it really got tired & boring by the end of the game!

Thanks for reading my novel, sorry that it's so long, but I wanted to cover everything! If you have any questions, or comments feel free! I'm alway's happy to help someone out, and I'm alway's up to improving my blocks!!

I will also try to post a couple cities that I've created recently, so you can download them and see just how it works.

Zorkk
zorkk@excite.com

posted 05-15-01 21:41 ET (US)     10 / 47  
Zorkk,

Your latest examples may be "closed" (whatever that means), but they certainly aren't "looped" since they don't have a loop.

More importantly, your gold mines might get labor access, but are highly likely to not have labor access part or all of the time. The "random" part of a labor-seeker's walk is often 26 or 27 tiles. Sometimes a labor-seeker walks farther, but not always, and even a longer walk might not reach the houses. I would be quite surprised if the 6 mines in your diagram all had labor access. (Similarly, the houses far from the water supply might not have reliable water coverage, depending on the length of the water carrier's walks.)

posted 05-15-01 22:30 ET (US)     11 / 47  
Brugle, They are looped. Just extend your thought. The roadblocks at each end can represent a traffic cirle. Closed, in the sense that only destination walkers can get in or out of that area.

Now, It's probably best not to give a block like this pottery, but I have used these types of configurations in my games, and the mines, or whatever industry you want, do get supplied with full labour, with no problem. Of course if your short workers, then the industry will be short workers.

Zorkk

posted 05-15-01 23:14 ET (US)     12 / 47  
Zorkk, I agree with Brugle that while a straight road can be "closed" it cannot be defined as looped. In my mind a loop is a closed circle that means that a walker continues right around the loop to return to his building.

I never rely on a straight road to provide labour access for a length longer than 27 tiles, a loop can extend that distance to 54 tiles. While you may sometimes get away with a longer one the probability of occasionally losing labour access when the labour seeker takes a shorter walk is too high for the risk in my opinion.

BTW otherwise I really like how you have explained housing blocks, I'm sure some newcomers in particular will learn a lot from it.

posted 05-16-01 12:36 ET (US)     13 / 47  
Hey zorkk;
I used a funkified (overly adapted, not as efficient as i wanted it to be) housing block that is above, the big ol' fancy one, and it really helped. I used to put houses in the inside of the circle, and the industries on the outside, and I had major lost walker problems. I had a "u" loop, (houses in the middle and outside of u, buildings on each tail, i think a grumpus) and the one 2x2 house nearest to the bazarr turned into an elegant residance, with nothing but mud huts around it! this also happened other seperate times, but the house was an apartament, or just a regular residance. after reading your post and replaying the mission, it helped me bunches. I also found it usefull to first get the roads in along with the neccicary buildings (docks, water men on dry levels, palaces) first, and to the 2x2 house, 2x2 garden pattern to get them to evolve properly (even with the water and beautification, some refused to get past the 4 square block of 1x1 housing! thats another question for another time, as it is not pressing) and then to quickly garden the road, so I can put in the plazas. when plazas are there, i remove gardens. I find this EXTREAMLY helpfull even for an industrial block, as the near housing evolves a little bit longer without complaining that a brewery is behind that wall of shrines. (i dont know why a wall of shrines is so funny to me... hehe)
SO, NOW TO THE REASON I POSTED THIS IN THE FIRST PLACE
you seem to like putting the bazaar just acrost the road. I have not noticed too much complaining that a bazaarr is right there, but this leads me to questioning that the housing is getting less desirability then the rest of the block, thus having an effect similar to having apartaments next to all the other fancy residences. have you (which has had much more pharaoh exp. then me) ever encountered this problem? I am just hesitant to stick that noisy bazar acrost the road... does it cause too much whining?

sorry for the essay

posted 05-18-01 19:13 ET (US)     14 / 47  
Great little piece you have there..looks like you worked hard at it
posted 05-18-01 20:07 ET (US)     15 / 47  
bifalvey,
The desirability of a location is the sum of the desirability effects of all nearby structures. When a house doesn't have enough desirability to evolve, it may report (for example) that a granary is making the neighborhood undesirable, but there is nothing special about the granary--the desirability simply has to increase to the required value in some way (deleting the granary, deleting other undesirable stuff, and/or adding desirable stuff).

Zorkk,
As Merepatra indicated, loops have important properties. While I disagree slightly with her numbers, buildings should always have labor access on a 48-tile intersection-free loop with a 2x2 house anywhere, while some buildings may not have labor access on a 25-tile intersection-free non-loop road with a 2x2 house at one end (even though a round-trip walk through all tiles would be the same distance). If your buildings have always had labor access with layouts like in reply #9, then labor-seekers have been unusually kind to you.

posted 05-19-01 17:22 ET (US)     16 / 47  
Very nice, Zorkk, but I have to agree with Brugle and Merepatra on the straight-line housing. My experience has been that str8-line housing needs to stay very short (less than 27 tiles for sure) to ensure something doesn't burn down or you lose some walker out on the ends. Also, if I have to provide labor to a str8-line industry like quarrying or mining, I always have to have a hut at both ends of a 27 tile road. I also use the 48-tile closed loop with one hut for industry, so I know that's stable as Brugle suggested.

Another thing I noticed. You said that Fancy Residences needed 45 points, but didn't catch I guess that that doesn't mean the housing needs to be passed by dancers.

Fancy Residences can be achieved with just a juggler (10 points) and musicians (20 points) as long as you have sufficient coverage citywide of all entertainment to earn 15 bonus points. It's even easier with just a senet house. NO intersections and perfect senet coverage citywide gives you the 45. (With Cleo 44, but you should be able to get one more point somewhere )

While I'm on entertainment, it's easier for me to rely on the coverage provided by random entertainment walkers (leaving the venue) than the destination walkers (going from the school to the venue). This is because with multiple schools in your city, you can never be sure which school will supply an entertainer for a given venue.

The last thing I want to add is that if your housing block is not working, but you know everything should, try switching out the building that spawns the defective walker with another building of the same size. I find just swapping a physician and a tax collector for example, can correct whatever random oddity that kept the walker from making it all the way around. This is expecially true of 2x2's I put on the inside corners.


A Tale in the Desert
Flogging will continue until morale improves.
posted 05-19-01 19:36 ET (US)     17 / 47  
My, I pop in (after many months) to check out the results of the Cup, and here's a subject to chime in on ....

I have to second Merepatra, Brugle & Homegrown...having done a bunch of tests on straight-line blocks (a long time ago, in a galaxy, far, far, away...), they really aren't consistently reliable. One of the problems (in addition to the fact that its not uncommon to see your labor recruiters get stuck walking in the wrong direction -- a phenomenon which is the crux of the benefit of true loops of 48-52 spaces maximum length (depending upon who you ask , for direction decisions are removed for a looping walker,is that the occasional long-walking labor recruiters don't provide labor access in the same way as regular recruiters. Regular recruiters (26 or 27 space walks, depending upon how you count) give 3 months of labor access, but long-walkers only provide flickering access, with long periods of total shutdown. I can imagine wanting to run a sprite-spawning building (fire, architect, hunting lodge) this way, under exceptional circumstances, but anything industrial will have its efficiency dramatically reduced.

That's my 2 cents. Hello, everybody.

I agree with Merepatra, BTW. The rest of the discussion here is great. Nice thread.

posted 05-21-01 16:04 ET (US)     18 / 47  
well. I have noticed you need a seed house, like a crude hut at least. the walkers walk by and get people to work, and apparantly they draw form a worker pool, and they only have access to this pool if they walk by ANY house. In situations like this, I also find fully employed buildings (1 crude hut) that generate employment walkers. are they like "ok this is cool, but I want someone closer" type of thing?
posted 05-23-01 20:25 ET (US)     19 / 47  
Brugle, Merepatra, JWorth, and Homegrown:

I'll admit, I haven't fully tested a 52 long straight road, in theory, I believe it should work, I know that i've had success with straight roads like that over 30 for sure. I guess I had better run some tests to find out for sure =)

Another note about straight line blocks, I ahve noticed that sometimes walkers will definatly only walk 1 way or the other, every single time. This problem is easily corrected by demolishing, and rebuilding the afflicting building. Usually in a different spot. Straight line blocks, are only neccesary when you need to supply labor to industries waaaaaaaaaaaaaay out in the boon docks, and I find i don't use them in too many games. I felt it necessary to include them in "adaptations" because I feel they are a valid housing "block" and may be needed. =) Thanks for the info tho, because it would just suck to build up a nice long straight block, and then not be able to get any workers to your industry.

Thanks everyone for your responses, I had originally planned just 1 short article, but once i got writing, it turned into a whole novel! So sorry about the length, but I do hope it's helping some people! =)

Zorkk

posted 05-24-01 00:10 ET (US)     20 / 47  
They also might be useful in some levels where there isn't much water, and large blocks cannot be built because of some terrain restraining them. An example might be Abedju or North Dashur.

Aegius the Athenian

Klik on the link abov 2 corrext my spellin

posted 11-30-01 09:05 ET (US)     21 / 47  
Zorkk this thread has been really useful to me! I'm a newcomer to Pharaoh and this advice gives me some good principles to work with rather than too much detail which would confuse at present.
Thanks a lot...
I think my web browser's starting to find it's own way to this forum now!!
posted 12-07-01 11:40 ET (US)     22 / 47  
Desmondius, your welcome! I'm glad someone's been able to use this! hehehe.. It'll be good reference for me when i come back to Pharaoh in a year or two when i'm bored and needing a building game! lol!

Z

posted 12-07-01 15:58 ET (US)     23 / 47  
I don't see any police stations in these blocks. If I tried that, I'd have thieves crawling all over me in no time.
posted 12-07-01 16:17 ET (US)     24 / 47  
Hi tomasball,

Some of the diagrams show a courthouse. Magistrates prevent crime even better than policemen.

posted 12-07-01 16:20 ET (US)     25 / 47  
tomasball,

Courthouses serve the same function as Police Stations. You don’t need both in the same housing block.


VAIA

Beaten to the reply by Brugle, again.

[This message has been edited by VitruviusAIA (edited 12-07-2001 @ 04:23 PM).]

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