ahh, I thought you'd put one up not that you were requesting one.

If someone has a spare half day or so there's been load of guidance spread over a dozen or so threads where people want to check something.

A tip from EoJ's recent endeavours as Spain - don't leave your entire forces where Bandito can snuff them out easily (boats / places assassins can get to / the moon / behind castle walls)

I think the number one tip is actually to grab Jerusalem and then ally with Bandito, making sure his attention is always other the other side of the map.

If anyone does, then I think the no.2 tip is trust no-one. If you do trust someone and tell them your plans, they'll probably go behind your back and kill you while your armies are away.

Well, I could write a guide, but that would mean losing a few advantage I have over the others.

But you nurture a generation of forumers that will forever worship the Bandito Protocol!

As far as i know, people only read the guide they never care who makes it =P

Why not just make a list of tips that people can contribute to?

A list of tips will be haphazard and lack the structure that a guide provides.

well, it could be a compilation of many different tips/guides of hotseats put together into one guide? why dont we start contributing now and make the guide then publish it?

A list of tips will be haphazard and lack the structure that a guide provides.

Hm, we could have a general catch all one- the contents of 'how to play multiplayer' thread's hotseat so people actually know how to play hotseat, and a list of basic tips and tricks.

Also, if we keep discussing it, I'll move this into articles soon.

As a contribution to anyone who wants to put a guide together, if they want to add something on running a hotseat to complement what's probably the main part of the guide, playing a hotseat, then here's the very few pointers I can give. I'm certainly not saying I'm right or that any guide needs to include anything on it, but if it helps at all that seems to be useful.

There are probably a few bits to address other than the interesting 'playing it' side- I'm sure there are lots of technical bits including posting pictures and how to change settlement names to amusing things that could be usefully covered. How to choose factions may be handy, but that's probably covered a bit in the general campaign section already (?) other than how relations with neighbouring humans impact it.

Ok, this is longer than I'd intended and still doesn't say much / have much point. It was probably a waste of time but there we go. Feel free to ignore it :0)

1. Work out roughly what you want (quite an obvious bit)

There's lots of scope for variety in a hotseat here are some factors that are worth considering:
- whether any specific campaign / mod is to be used
- whether you want a theme within that, such as western European factions only
- whether you want in anyway to try and balance the factions or just let people pick for themselves (e.g. putting the best player as a harder faction)
- whether you're involving a set group of friends or running the game with forumers (not saying forum people aren't all friends, just using it as a distinction somehow)
- how much time you're prepared to allow the game to take up, e.g. can you spend a couple of evenings a week or more / less
- do you want to be fighting battles or focusing solely on the campaign map (there's been lots of discussion on this elsewhere so could be padded out into a "how to choose whether to autoresolve battles" section) - this impacts heavily on time
- how large do you want the game to be, 2 players, 5 players, 15 players etc (the last one would be, err, interesting shall we say - interesting in a very slow way unless you have 15 people in one venue to play it) - this also impacts heavily on time
- difficulty settings to be used

2. Expect things to go wrong

Hotseats can take a long time, hotseatA has been going for the best part of a year (depending how much you like christmas ) - larger games, particularly with people off the forum, are likely to be relatively slow - even if you move at a steady 'two turns per week' (reasonable for a 5 person hotseat I'd say) then that's only 100 turns a year.

People may go on holiday, vanish (particularly in forum games) or become locked in another player's basement (particularly games involving Bandito). Having clear up-front rules regarding substitutes is a very good thing as far as I can see, if people don't know what's going on then it can get messy.

A method that has worked in hotseatA is to have a certain window (4 days) whereby if a player has received a turn and not passed it on within the timelimit a sub is used. If that time is getting close a reminder is sent and if the player is in contact then the sub won't be used without consent. I.e. if someone is caught on the hop with illness or an exam or something taking an extra day (given it's not a rushed one) isn't a problem. Without such a rule then you get issues with people milling around asking what's going on and it can take longer.

To make substitutes work, you need to have passwords kept somewhere. Preferably in several places as password holders can vanish, go on holiday or, quite possibly, end up locked in basements.

When people give the passwords, they may not write them down properly. The password holder(s) could do much worse than checking that the passwords do actually work when first given them. You don't need to use passwords so if you can all trust each other, you may not want to.

It's also handy to have some sort of provision for if the person who is responsible for making sure the above bits of gumph work properly goes on holiday / vanishes etc. That's a bit more awkward on forum games, if for no other reason than the opening post is useful to give a status update and not just anyone can edit that.

Before starting a hotseat, it could be worth considering sending around a save file to check that everyone can actually open and play it. Yes Windows Vista, I'm look at you here.

3. Status etc

People seem to like having at least a bare minimum of information - mainly "where is the save?" keeping track of that as well as who plays each faction is highly useful.

You can add more information such as ranking scrolls but there's some question as to whether it adds much - it mainly depends on if you can be bothered I suppose.

You could go the whole hog and put a campaign map somewhere central every few turns - that'd probably only work if you've got someone neutral who can open up the saves / be allowed to cheat to lift the fog of war (such as the password holder or maybe the person running the game if they're not actually playing)

4. Be clear on the rules

Based on 1 and 2 above - there are lots of situations that can come up, be it in-game or involving the players. There are choices that aren't too nice to make such as "when to we say to use a sub" but if they're laid out nice and clearly upfront all that goes away.
You can have general "don't exploit" rules, which are open to opinion, or if you're brave list exactly what you do and don't mind.
If you're planning on a fast game, consider getting some subs lined up and putting in place a "if your turn isn't played within 24hrs the sub does it" rule - maybe even a more harsh "if your turn isn't played within 24hrs I'll disband your faction".
Don't like spies or assassins? Ban them, just tell people before they agree to play the game. Simples.
Any rule you want, just be clear.

But you nurture a generation of forumers that will forever worship the Bandito Protocol!

I am always happy to share my knowledge with fellow forumers. Alas, my knowledge is not only limited to game mechanics and simple tips as such but it extends to strategies--strategies I am implementing or will implement soon in hot-seat A. As that hot-seat is in a very critical stage for me, I simply cannot reveal my moves now, can I? I will write the guide as soon as I have peace, or I am eliminated...whichever comes first.

good job swamp, now they know how to start a campaign, problem comes when the game actually starts, ill try writing a guide on my own free time if possible, i may not have much experience, but that doesnt mean im dumb =)

Alright. I made up my mind that I will write an in depth guide of hot-seat game play over the weekends. Meanwhile you guys are welcome to mail me your knowledge and insights regarding the topic. The more thorough the guide is, the better for the viewers, no?

Excellent, I'll look forward to seeing that. I anticipate that there's a lot I could learn or do better, I've already learned one point from playing with Bandito...

Technically the guide ought to apply to singleplayer too - but the AI and diplomacy would probably be somewhat more straightforward there.

I'll send one or two thoughts at some point - as you'll have seen from my performance in the hotseats they may not be shining examples of what to do but could include some things to avoid...

I began the project. If all goes well I will finish it by Monday.

I doubt there is anything I can add that others haven't thought of already, but I'll read the guides when they're up and see if I can contribute.

Darn it Bandito! I made a good start, i explained in depth, how to start a hot seat, how to keep it organized, and how to play basically against humans. I hope you add it to your guide. ill email the notebook text to you if you will But if you do, I want credit, so make sure to add my name in your credits section =P if your going to add my start up. tell me if you want it. Oh, and if you don't want it, then ill finish it myself and make sure it completely obliterates your guide in terms of helpfulness! >=O

[This message has been edited by Demigodseer (edited 12-01-2009 @ 09:28 PM).]

Actually, Demi, I need such an introductory guide, of what is hot-seat, and how to set up the game. I am so busy with the details of war, I simply do not have time to come up with an intro into hot-seat. I was planning to just copy-paste the hot-seat sticky in the MP forum. If you can make good of this "I made a good start, i explained in depth, how to start a hot seat, how to keep it organized, and how to play basically against humans" and send it to me, I will give you the due credit in my guide. My e-mail is in my profile.

Currently I finished writing about each and every nations' advantages and disadvantages in hot-seat and the proper use of agents. I still need to write about how to make economy boom, shrewd diplomacy, and finally tackle that big thing known as war waging. The guide is like a Hydra, growing more heads as I write more.

[This message has been edited by el_bandito (edited 12-02-2009 @ 08:53 PM).]

Crush it with a rock!! CRUSH IT WITH A ROCK!!

I, *cough* err. Looking forward to reading this :].

good to know. cause honestly i doubt i wouldve stood up against your guide. i went into the game playing a little to, you can read and remove parts you think are not neccesary or are wrong or that you already have. Honestly i didnt think of explaining Nations advantages. I spent so much time thinking of new subjects to talk about like "diplomacy" or "Manipulating the AI" or "The Popes Power" .... well.. actually i never got to the Pope, but you get the idea. Sending the Small guide in notebook form.

Guys, you realise that we can have more than one guide on the same subject?

Quoted from Heratic:

we can have more than one guide on the same subject

Heresy! (or is that hear-say?)
There can be only one True Guide, all other attempts at being a guide are blasphemy. Even if the other guide is almost identical to the True Guide then it'd still be entirely wrong and probably more sinful than an anti-Guide.

Umm, that could have been a little random and off topic, sorry. I still intend to send some unhelpful comments to Bandito to hopefully help with the one True Guide.

Demi, I read your guide, and I found it very nicely done for an intro. Thanks a million.

I finished writing about Economy but Diplomacy and Warfare still remain.

Diplomacy...is...finished. Only War remains. I need to get this off my neck soon.

Ok, the guide is finished...sorta. I need to let it stay for a day or two and see if I wanna change something (a writer's habit I picked up), and then I will send it to EoJ.