As I understand there will be all new factions for the BI, the old factions will not exist. You could always mod to have the old ones, not sure what purpose it would serve though.

[This message has been edited by Tuke (edited 08-09-2005 @ 06:05 PM).]

Shield wall, from what I've experienced playing the demo thus far, is nothing more than a simple defensive block. Wether it's to help save a troop, or to buy time for a cavalry-flank attack, it's just a way of halting an enemy advance. (It also seemed like an effective shield against arrows).

As for the old factions, I don't think so. There's Rome: Total War for that. ;D

Okay the way TW games have always worked for their expansion campagins is you can choose between the original campagin and the expansion campagin. They are completely seperate from each other. When you go to play a custom battle you will hav to choose between the original era and the X-pack era before you start. When you go to the campagin selection you will choose between the imperial campagin and the barbarian invasion campagin.

Also CA said the demo has none of the gameplay tweaks that the finished product will have.

My reaction to the demo was...meh. The AI seems just as bad, if not worse. As the Romans in Chalons, I used those Scorpions mounted on the chariots to completely slaughter the Hunnic force. I took out most of their forces with my Alan Horse Archers and my Scorpions on carts. Pretty sad that they did next to nothing to stop me. They sent their cavalry at me one by one, and I slaughtered them. After a while, I just got tired of it, withdrew my horsearchers and Scorpions then threw my army at one unit and watched them fight. I ended up winning a clear victory. I actually lost Badon Hill the first time. That was because I sent my cavalry to capture and hold the other bank of the river, but the onagers seem to prefer to let boulders capture the other side. A flaming onager round went rogue and killed Flavius Artorius as he was crossing the river with my cavalry. The second time, I sent my infantry in first. The onagers stopped firing, and I rushed my cavalry across the bank and slaughtered everyone left, then ran to rescue the other general.

It's got a lot of issues, but looking more closely at it, I think they can be ironed out. The demo is horridly incomplete. Using Alt-attack, the Germanic Bodyguards take their spears and swing them like swords. In the Badon Hill battle, with the Alemanni, I managed to rout all of the Saxon forces attacking the hill. One final wave came in to attack, but they didn't stay. At the base of the hill, they routed for no apparent reason. I really hope this improves.

On another note, I LOVE the morale messages. A welcome throwback to Medieval Total War. Now if only the soldiers would fight as hard as they do in Medieval.

[This message has been edited by Ace Cataphract (edited 08-09-2005 @ 09:30 PM).]

Well how is the shield wall different from the phalanx? besides that shield wall troops don't have long spears?

Is it possible to play a game like Greeks vs. Franks in the Skirmish mode?

But shield wall really isn't anything like phalanx. In shield wall, they have a densely packed formation that's hard to break. Soldiers in shield wall can also charge. In phalanx, it's far more inflexible and relies on the spears for defense instead of the shields.

If it's anything like Medieval, you won't be able to play expansion factions vs original ones.

The A.I needs some work. When I did Badon Hill with the Saxons the Romano-British just sat on their side of the river while I slaughtered the Alemanni on the hill. And Chalone wasn't mutch of a challenge. The units and barbarian interface look good and the game it has a nice feel to it, but the A.I doesn't seem to be improved.

Quote:

Yah, that was a nice surprise.

I have a problem. Hopefully the screenshots will help. I can't run the exe.

[JPEG, (167.96 KB)]

[JPEG, (172.04 KB)]

?

If I'm not mistaken you are viewing the contents of the zipped Barbarian Invasion folder, and trying to run the exe while it's zipped. You have to go back and extract the whole folder to a location (mine's on my desktop for now), and then you run the exe.

Did anyone experience a performance drop in the demo, as compared to RTW?

At Badon Hill, yes. It seemed to slow down when I got near the river crossing in the pre-battle cutscene.

I noticed a significant degrade in performance. In BI, the battle of Bardon Hill, seems really boxy and rough. The trees radiate upward into the sky. It seems to only happen on night battles with BI, but even then on RTW in custom battles my computer never had difficulties with night battles. My guess is it's those damn torches.

My feelings are somewhat mixed. The AI sometimes acts quite cleverly (I faced some tricky flanking manouvers), at other times plain stupid. I am afraid we probably cannot judge from the demo battles alone.

On the other hand I had the feeling that quite a few of the units last longer and do not rout at first impact. Strangely for the era cavalry seems toned down.

At one of the custom battles (from the additional battle pack) a unit of archers and one of bucelarii did quite some damage on skirmish mode, practically routing three Saxon units with missiles and another two in mellee, so they may actually turn out to be quite usefull. So far I could single out the Bucelarii and the mounted ballistae as promising.

The schiltron formation does some good job too and opens some new opportunities for infantry. You can use those troops in flanking attacks or to draw the enemy to surround them and then hit them in the rear. And the units in schiltron seem to last longer.

Otherwise - not really impressed, especially since it looks as if there will be less variety amongst factions and most will have similar troops. I am starting to miss Britain and Parthia. But let's wait and see.

I agree. But you have to realize something: of course many of the factions are going to have the same troops. For the most part, they are using what once was Rome's greatest legionaries.

Cmon its only a demo, it won't be like this when its released (i hope)

To answer the original question, a shieldwall isn't the same as a phalanx.

The shield wall is a formation available to some (mainly barbarian) units. The unit ‘locks’ itself in position, presenting an almost-impregnable front to the enemy as shields are overlapped. This grants a massive defensive bonus, but means that the unit is vulnerable if attacked in the flanks or rear. Units in a shield wall formation can still move, but they are slow and not quite as defensively effective. It isn't - and this is an important proviso - limited only to spear troops. The Saxon Hearth Troops are heavy swordsmen and are capable of using the shield wall.

You have no idea how happy it makes me to see you here. My many thanks to you for visiting us. I was always hoping we'd see a blue person here someday.

It's like London buses...you wait for ages and then two come along at once

To be honest, this has to be one of the greatest moments in my life so far. Since the day RTWH was founded, we have been waiting for the army of blue names to pop up around the forums.

Again, many thanks for joining us, Intrepid C I F and CaptainFishpants!

Is there, by the way, any chance of us seeing you guys on this week's forum party? I have always wanted to lock horns with the developers... or more accurately, show them the ropes!

[This message has been edited by GloryofSparta (edited 08-10-2005 @ 10:47 PM).]

On the whole, I liked it. This demo surely had much more than the RTW demo. The units feel more diverse than the units in RTW. The only thing I didn't particularly like is the Ballista Carriage.

[This message has been edited by Imperatorius (edited 08-10-2005 @ 02:49 PM).]

Many appologies for the stupid question, but what is an Ambassador (VIP) in blue. Appologies again...

Those are none other than the developers of Rome: Total War.

(And don't feel bad for not knowing. I don't think we've had one here before.)

Wow, some VIPS! Welcome!

Avē CaptainFishpants and Intrepid C I F! Welcome to RTWH.

The.........developers!?!??!ooooo..........awwww...