Cart pushers using a road-and-garden path when no road connection exists

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Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » Caesar III: Game Help » Cart pushers using a road-and-garden path when no road connection exists

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Topic Subject: Cart pushers using a road-and-garden path when no road connection exists

Brugle
HG Alumnus

posted 07-16-11 13:55 ET (US)

When a cart pusher has decided to go to a building, it can use a road-and-garden path to get there. Usually, this occurs only when the cart pusher has a road connection to the building. But there are three situations where a cart pusher will use a road-and-garden path even if a road connection doesn't exist.

One is trivial: a road connection existed when the cart pusher began his trip but the roads were changed and now only a road-and-garden path exists. This typically occurs on the cart pusher's return trip.

Another is a warehouse cart pusher that is going to (or returning from) another warehouse to get a good. He does not need a road connection, but will use a road or a road-and-garden path if it exists.

The third is when cart pushers get messed up after a road is built or deleted. In PalacePeaks (the city I am building to have 320 full luxury palaces), several times I saw food farm or wharf cart pushers taking road-and-garden paths to deliver to granaries that weren't connected by road. Eventually I investigated carefully, and discovered that wharf cart pushers that had been sitting under a full granary went to a distant granary to deliver their fish in one case after an isolated road was deleted and in another case after an isolated road was connected to another road.

Fortunately, there appears to be an easy (although perhaps tedious) way to prevent this problem. In my tests, if the game is saved immediately after the road is deleted or built, then the problem didn't occur when that saved game is loaded. (By "immediately" I mean that pause ('P') is hit before the mouse click that builds or deletes is released.) I intend to follow this procedure in PalacePeaks every time that I either delete an isolated road or build a road connecting multiple roads (turning them into one road).

I guess that only cart pushers who are standing may be affected by this problem. I'm just speculating, but I suspect that each standing cart pusher has a road number, and that periodically the game checks whether the road number of a standing cart pusher matches the road number of a granary or warehouse that has space for the goods in his cart, and that completely deleting a road or connecting an isolated road to another road causes the roads to be renumbered, and that the road numbers assigned to standing cart pushers are not changed when such a renumbering occurs.

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 07-16-2011 @ 02:01 PM).]

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Brugle
HG Alumnus

posted 06-07-23 08:08 ET (US) 1 / 6

While building "Blood Under The Bridge", I found a fourth situation where a cart pusher will use a road-and-garden path even when a road connection doesn't exist. When two different road networks touch a warehouse, one touching the northern tile and another larger one, with a garden path between them, a cart pusher generated on the larger road network can deliver (through the gardens) to the warehouse's northern tile. (Reply #1 of C3 random walker start and finish points shows how to determine the larger road network.) For an explanation, see Trium's Cartpushers, traders, etc. - which building is nearest?, noting that deliveries to a warehouse will go to the northern tile if it is touching a road.

After decades, we are still learning about C3!

SevenSoul
Pleb

posted 06-07-23 11:25 ET (US) 2 / 6

This is why I never put gardens in road corners. The walker might cut the corner through the garden and not reach a house that's too far out diagonally from the road. Mainly for prefects and engineers returning to their stations

mathieu
Pleb

posted 06-12-23 04:02 ET (US) 3 / 6

Thats a very nice catch. The funny thing is, that a direct road connection actually is a strict requirement when the warehouse for delivery is selected. So both buildings need to be connected to the same road network id. I would assume, that for a warehouse, even though the walker is spawning on the northern tile, the bigger road network is selected as its main road network id. Did you test, if a workshop or raw material building can deliver to the warehouse if it is connected to the shorter loop? In my test, the building couldn't deliver to the warehouse. With or without gardens. Only workshops and raw materials connected to the big loop delivered to the warehouse (using the gardens to reach the northern tile). This would confirm, that the northern delivery/spawning point of a warehouse, isn't necessarily it's main road network.

[This message has been edited by mathieu (edited 06-12-2023 @ 04:16 AM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus

posted 06-12-23 06:18 ET (US) 4 / 6

Quoted from mathieu:
Did you test, if a workshop or raw material building can deliver to the warehouse if it is connected to the shorter loop? In my test, the building couldn't deliver to the warehouse. With or without gardens.

No, just with farms, but I would expect your results.

So, just to be complete, I decided to test if wheat farms or clay pits or pottery workshops on the longer loop would deliver to the warehouse without gardens. They didn't, and the cart pushers disappeared almost immediately (losing their goods). Then I finally remembered having seen something like that by another player many years ago, which I don't have time to look for now but will check later.

mathieu
Pleb

posted 06-12-23 08:32 ET (US) 5 / 6

Sorry did you test with buildings connected to the shorter or longer loop?

I quickly tested both options. Those are my results:

- Long loop without gardens: Doesn't work
- Long loop with gardens: Works
- Short loop with/without gardens: Doesn't work

I had the same behaviour regarding the goods. They lose them instantly instead of waiting in front of the building. I was a little confused, that buildings connected to the short loop don't deliver to the warehouse as well. But as already mentioned, the process only selects warehouses which are connected to the same road network. Considering this fact, the behaviour is "correct". The only difference is, that cart pushers spawning on the short loop, don't lose the goods. They wait in front of the workshop/farm.

[This message has been edited by mathieu (edited 06-12-2023 @ 08:33 AM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus

posted 06-12-23 12:56 ET (US) 6 / 6

I couldn't find the example from years ago.

Quoted from mathieu:
did you test with buildings connected to the shorter or longer loop?

I said "I decided to test if wheat farms or clay pits or pottery workshops on the longer loop would deliver to the warehouse without gardens", so it was on the longer loop. (I also tested on the shorter loop, but the results were as expected, agreeing with yours.)

Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » Caesar III: Game Help » Cart pushers using a road-and-garden path when no road connection exists

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