The Japanese Consolate Surprise - Age of Empires III Heaven Forum

Topic Subject: The Japanese Consolate Surprise

LordPatrick18
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 06:39 AM EDT (US)

The Japanese Consolate Surprise

This strat can only be used when you have a 300 wood start. It aims to have either 20 Ashigaru Musks, or 15 30% boosted Musks at 6:30, with more coming all the time.

This is just one strat I have made using the Consolate, all of which you will see in time.

Required Cards

Advanced Wonders
Daimyo (Age II)
600 Gold
5 Ashigaru Muskets
Musketeer Combat (Correct Name?)

Build Order

AGE I

1) All Villagers on food, 2 on Crates. Never stop queuing Villagers.

2)Once you have gathered your 300 wood, build a Consolate using 2 Crate Villagers, and Ally with Ports immediately.

3)With your explorers gather all nearby treasures. Gather a wood treasure ASAP if it is available.

4)Your first card is Advanced Wonders

5)If you found a wood treasure, build a shrine with your explorer without adjusting Villagers. If you did not, send 1 Villager to gather 6 wood, then back to food.

6)Once you have 680 food, age up with The Tori Gates. You should have 13/14 Villagers at this stage. Don't stop queuing Villagers.

TRANSITION

7) Gather 106 wood with 5 or 6 Villagers. Build a Shrine with your Explorer, and set them to Food. All new Villagers go to food.

8)Send your wood Villagers to gather 200 Gold. Once done, put 2 on wood, the rest on food.

AGE II

9) You should hit Colonial around the 4:40 mark. Send your Daimyo ASAP, and build your barracks forward.

10)Queue 5 Musks with your Daimyo, who is also forward.

11)Send 600 Gold. It should arrive when your Barracks is just finished, use the Gold to queue 10 Musks between Barracks and Daimyo.

12)You should have 100 Export at this stage. Burn relations once you do, and Choose Japanese Isolation, which will boost your musks.

13)You now have 15 Musks at around the 6:15 mark outside your opponents base, and should have 5 more coming. You can either send a further 5, or the boost for your Musks.

This is very similar to Cookie's JAMM, I just thought it was a good way to use the 300 wood start. Also, I have been debating with a different strat, aging up with the Big Shrine, for housing, and then sending forward vills, which might increase times.

Tell me what you think.

Congratulations Serge - Winner of the FFA Spring Series 2008

Author

Replies:

Tordenskiold
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 07:53 AM EDT (US) 1 / 23

What's the point of sending advanced wonder as first card ??

I would send 2 shrines instead, then the strategy can be used not matter how many wood crates you have from start and you don't have to collect any wood during advancement

TORDENSKIOLD(1690-1720)

During the Great Nordic War (1700-1720), he was commander of the danish navy, which defeaded the swedish army at Kristiania (modern Oslo). After the war, he was killed in a duel on Nov. 12, 1720 just outside Hamburg, Germany, during a travel to England.

ESO: TORDENSKIOLD

LordPatrick18
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 11:24 AM EDT (US) 2 / 23

Advanced Wonders reduces age up time by 30 seconds. You could send 2 shrines and use it from a 200 wood start, but then your going to be slower.

I'll try it out with 2 shrines later, but IMO you need that 30 seconds.

Congratulations Serge - Winner of the FFA Spring Series 2008

Tordenskiold
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 12:19 PM EDT (US) 3 / 23

The 2 shrines collect food so it's not 30 seconds slower - no even close.

dejanh
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 12:38 PM EDT (US) 4 / 23

I'm not 100% sure, but this may get owned by Yumi archers in a Japanese mirror or by xbows if facing Chinese. In fact, a good Chinese will hit you so early and so hard that you won't get a chance to waste your time making muskets that melt under xbow fire.

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Lord_Richjp
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 12:46 PM EDT (US) 5 / 23

What is the effect of Advanced wonders?

My grandmother slaps harder than the Agra Fort shoots. And she's dead. ~ Ender_Ward

By the same token, if I attempt to operate the mouse using nothing but my butt-cheeks, micro will also come down to "luck." ~ Beatnikjoe

LordPatrick18
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 01:25 PM EDT (US) 6 / 23

Ashigaru Muskets and Daimyo don't fare too badly against CkN. And every strat has civs it won't work against.

Advanced Wonders makes them 50% stronger, and builds them 25% faster.

EDIT: Tried it with 2 Shrines, doesn't work. You need the 30 seconds, as it takes that long to get your Military Rickshaw forward and built, and for your Daimyo to arrive.

Congratulations Serge - Winner of the FFA Spring Series 2008

[This message has been edited by LordPatrick18 (edited 10-30-2007 @ 02:30 PM).]

Unthinking_Pain
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 02:36 PM EDT (US) 7 / 23

Once you have 680 food

Uh, doesn't aging up still take 800 food? Advanced Wonders doesn't reduce the cost.

EDIT - Like Duh, the Port allies lower the cost, nm

[This message has been edited by Unthinking_Pain (edited 10-30-2007 @ 02:41 PM).]

Jewdochop
Skirmisher

posted 10-30-07 04:39 PM EDT (US) 8 / 23

hmm i MAY edit this into my overall JAMM work. just try to forego 1 house and wait and get consulate.

Catabre
BFME2H Replay Reviewer - Library Guildsman

posted 10-31-07 10:56 AM EDT (US) 9 / 23

EDIT - Like Duh, the Port allies lower the cost, nm

Oh, that's he was using the Ports for. lol, I'm an idiot.

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Shogun_Sushi
Skirmisher

posted 11-02-07 07:53 PM EDT (US) 10 / 23

IMO, this strategy is too slow and will get owned by most colonial, since most civs in colonial will have light infantry.

Instead, you should try something with the cav or a surprise samurai rush. These little buggers can really devastate a city in no time. Sumurai rush would only be against a pure FF though.

LordPatrick18
Skirmisher

posted 11-02-07 08:02 PM EDT (US) 11 / 23

Um, too slow? Enlighten me if you would, how you would go about getting decent numbers of units out earlier than 6:15 without completely screwing your eco.

As for your LI* theory, AM don't actually fare too badly against the, due to their speed. And the Daimyo can train Naginata to deal with them in the long term.

Congratulations Serge - Winner of the FFA Spring Series 2008

Jewdochop
Skirmisher

posted 11-02-07 10:57 PM EDT (US) 12 / 23

yea... first this is quite fast, second samurai are terrible for rushing. too expencive for the bang as it were. naginata being alot better, and able to counter what you will probably be facing.

Shogun_Sushi
Skirmisher

posted 11-03-07 01:31 PM EDT (US) 13 / 23

First of all, what level do you play this against.

Against most colonial, ex: french double x-bow spam, he'll get a decent amount of x-bows, which will kill your musquets pretty well, since they have no range resist.

This is a decent startegy, but you shouldn't try it against most standard colonials, since they will have mostly bows/skirmisher-like units.

It can do well against an FF or raiding though.

LordPatrick18
Skirmisher

posted 11-03-07 07:47 PM EDT (US) 14 / 23

Well considering I only got TAD today, I havn't really played on a consisitant level. But I am 1st Lieut so that's the standard I'd compare my strats to.

Em, obviously Musks are going to lose out to Xbows. That's like criticising an Xbow rush saying, "This strat is decent, but agaisnt a Sioux Axe Rider Rush, it will get destroyed".

Every strat has it's weaknesses. But if you mean, that your opponent is liekly to have some skirm units out by the time you attack, then it's not a bad thing. Musks, although they do lose in the logn run, hold their own fairly well against LI*. And you have the Daimyo, which can train Naginatas if need be.

Congratulations Serge - Winner of the FFA Spring Series 2008

Shogun_Sushi
Skirmisher

posted 11-04-07 10:05 AM EDT (US) 15 / 23

Yes I think your musquets can do fairly well vs bows, but they will still loose pretty badly.

I think that you should try to harass your enemy at the beggining when you got your units at like 6:15, bring them to the enemy, kill a few vills, try to kill the army they have and kill their baracks. If the have too many x-bows, then you should really retreat, and not loose too much (4.5 speed). If you can overwelm their units and destroy their baracks, then you'r in pretty good shape. Keep the pressure, while trying to boom a little bit at home.

If their army is too big, retreat and while doing so, make as many nagita riders as you can (4-5), while still harrassing the ennemy (hit and run their vills) while trying to go around their army. Once you get 5 nagita out, then you'll be able to face their x-bows/skirmishlike units with 5 nagita with your remaining musqueteer (around 12-16).

Yep, I think it can do well against the enemmy, but always keep the pressure on them. Never fight the enemmy if you know they will beat you (because it sounds like you do so).
*Musks, although they do lose in the logn run, hold their own fairly well against LI*

cu3hara
Skirmisher

posted 11-06-07 11:24 AM EDT (US) 16 / 23

Thanks LordPatrick, I've actually found this to be a generally useful opening in more situations than you describe. On low wood starts, I might have to chop wood to get near 200 then cruise there via shrines.

But the benefits are getting up to Age 2 at any time (4:30 or faster at a cost in VS) with more villies than normal. You also have a consulate immediately, so you can start shipping in Isolation units (anti-cav if going yumi, ranged units with good siege if going ashi). You can send a mil rickshaw for a stable and hold off on a Daimyo.

It opens up some fun options. Thanks again!

cue

Beatnik Joe
Skirmisher

posted 11-06-07 11:51 AM EDT (US) 17 / 23

Nice job! I did something kind of like this for India, but it looks like it's an even better fit for Japan. Looks like a lot of fun!

Strategies:
- BWKiC - A British Fast Fortress strategy
- The Aztec Scout Slam- An Envoy Rush, Native-Style

wolfe_clayton2
Skirmisher

posted 02-19-08 10:13 AM EDT (US) 18 / 23

lol i love u lord pat haha being ur clan member u have one many games and any stragety u say works everyone should be willing to try

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Rank:2 lt
I play:japs

TheBengals3
Skirmisher

posted 02-19-08 08:47 PM EDT (US) 19 / 23

Ashis beat xbows. end of story

A_US_James246
Scenario Reviewer
(id: James246)

posted 05-02-08 04:31 AM EDT (US) 20 / 23

Um....

5)If you found a wood treasure, build a shrine with your explorer without adjusting Villagers. If you did not, send 1 Villager to gather 6 wood, then back to food.

Why do you send a villager to gather 6 wood, then go back?

What is the point of this?

Flair
Skirmisher

posted 05-02-08 05:54 AM EDT (US) 21 / 23

Why do you send a villager to gather 6 wood, then go back?

What is the point of this?

Obviously he needed 6 more wood to build a shrine.

A_US_James246
Scenario Reviewer
(id: James246)

posted 05-02-08 10:29 PM EDT (US) 22 / 23

Also, not to sound like a noob, what is a "DAIMYO"? I know it is some kind of card, but what does it do?

CookieCrisp13
Skirmisher

posted 05-02-08 11:57 PM EDT (US) 23 / 23

Lets try not to resurrect old threads please

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