And you might find the origins of the name 'Domovoi' in any random Artemis Fowl book. Domovoi was Artemis' butler/bodyguard and I know for a fact that Catabre loves Artemis Fowl to the death.

In case you didn't know about the above, check here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domovoi_Butler

Who knows, perhaps the King could be called Artemis Fowl?

Now this is just BS. There's no way Catabre is using Artemis Fowl characters in a Lego Castle Mafia, it doesn't matter how much he likes them. That's like claiming SpongeBob in a Batman Mafia using the theory that the host likes SpongeBob. Plus, the king is not Artemis Fowl, his name is

Quoted from OP:

good king Leo

I was about to point out how I I'd say having Artemis names makes no sense, but two people have already done it for me. I'd say Heir has to be scum - it looks just like he's made a load of background guff with which to support his role.

unvote
vote: Heir

Incidentally:

We could lynch Heir, but it would basically be a random choice, as we didn't really have anything to pin on him.

Now I like getting a bundle of claims, so if Heir wasn't such a nice choice I'd agree completely (I don't think its a random lynch any more, its a lynch for a bungled claim). However going for Nacht does seem to be almost a random choice in itself, and I always thought you where part of the "get as few claims as possible" school of thought.

unvote

vote Heir

I agree, I don't think we could get anything better than this. Vote: Heir

I was just pointing out possible origins of my role name. And, I can assure you, I am Domovoi. And Artemis Fowl is the only place where I can find any logical origin to my name. And it does make a lot of sense.

Still, I'm pretty sure now that the town(and scum too) are going to push for my lynch. Which means that yet another innocent protective townie is going to be murdered.

The arguments against me are simply based on the assumption that there 3 protective roles in an 18 player game are a bit too much. That is, simply put, a ridiculous reason to be lynching someone. Especially with the two mafias in the game. And I feel that there should be at least 2 investigative roles in this game or at leas a tracker of some sort. Have them target me and therefore confirm me instead of lynching me on the basis of my role-name.

Now this is just BS. There's no way Catabre is using Artemis Fowl characters in a Lego Castle Mafia, it doesn't matter how much he likes them. That's like claiming SpongeBob in a Batman Mafia using the theory that the host likes SpongeBob.

Pin that down on Catabre, not me. He likes Artemis Fowl and he decided to put in a pretty logical character from it into this game. He makes the role names and he decides. Hardly my fault. If people are going to be lynched on the basis of their role-names now, we might as well abandon playing Mafia.

Also, what is BS?

I think town would be better off at this stage by looking out for more scum rather than lynching a claimed protective role. At least as long as there are ways to confirm my role.

If people are going to be lynched on the basis of their role-names now, we might as well abandon playing Mafia.

We didn't lynch Gollum in Two Towers mafia and he wound up winning as the SK. Role names do mean stuff.

To me, I think that it is fitting, for a bodyguard, but to be honest, what kind of idiot scum would claim as an Artemis Fowl character? That's my thinking, but whether you believe me or not is an entirely different matter.

Quoted from Henrz:

To me, I think that it is fitting, for a bodyguard, but to be honest, what kind of idiot scum would claim as an Artemis Fowl character? That's my thinking, but whether you believe me or not is an entirely different matter

WIFOM

Quoted from Heir:

Also, what is BS?

Bullshit

Well then can someone provide a link to all the lego characters? I want to check if all the roles so far and mine are actual characters.

and I always thought you where part of the "get as few claims as possible" school of thought.

I'm not actually convinced that Heir's claim is bungled (although referring to Artemis Fowl was a totally bad idea). However, I think it's almost worth lynching him just so we can analyse the bandwagon tomorrow, and lose an at best unimportant role.

Most of Heir's defence seems terrible to me ("you're going to lynch another protective role!"), but I'm not yet convinced he's scum.

At least as long as there are ways to confirm my role.

What would those be? I can't see any way.

We didn't lynch Gollum in Two Towers mafia and he wound up winning as the SK. Role names do mean stuff.

Well firstly I've played in games where the Sith have been town and Jedi scum, for example. While claiming a scummy name in a themed game is a dubious strategy at best, a name alone shouldn't be enough to make a lynch. In this its not the name its the fluff that comes with it - looks a lot like he's trying to prop up his claim by looking at what Cat might of done.

owever, I think it's almost worth lynching him just so we can analyse the bandwagon tomorrow, and lose an at best unimportant role.

Who can we discriminate against, though? Nacht threw on a vote pretty quickly, but to be honest I'd use throwing down a vote as making it known I want a claim, as opposed to just asking nicely. It's not like it was pushing Heir dangerously close to a lynch.

Littlefreak put on a vote after the claim, but I don't see how "I don't believe that claim, I'll vote for you" is a scummy argument - perhaps we should be taking a step back and looking at other people, but the only other person to look at from Freaks position was Nacht. I like to think my vote on Heir was justified (obviously), because I believe pursuing Nacht doesn't have a great deal of merit - I'm happy with getting a claim from him, but I don't see a great deal that will stop me lynching Heir, which means Nacht can be done today or tomorrow.

Personally I'd be most suspicious of Drinian of Fruit because they're literally hopping on the bandwagon at the end and not offering anything else, but again I think Heir is a good enough target that it could just be unfortunate timing on their part.

Quoted from Heir:

Ok. If the majority, that is 7 out of the 12 people apart from me say(no need to vote) that I roleclaim, then I roleclaim. Fair enough?

I can see 3 people wanting me to claim presently. The moment we get a majority, I claim.

I misread the first part and just saw the part about waiting for the majority. Even if I had understood it, I probably would have thought it to be a pointless request, since there wasn't really any danger of being speedlynched.

I'm not actually convinced that Heir's claim is bungled (although referring to Artemis Fowl was a totally bad idea). However, I think it's almost worth lynching him just so we can analyze the bandwagon tomorrow, and lose an at best unimportant role.

Well, I just saw someone saying that they couldn't find my role name on some lego site, so I searched for alternative origins to my name on Google and came up with that Artemis Fowl name, which seemed very plausible to me, especially when placed in light of Catabre's love of Artemis Fowl.

And I found no reason to withhold any information from anyone because I am not scum.

Most of Heir's defence seems terrible to me ("you're going to lynch another protective role!"), but I'm not yet convinced he's scum.

That might be because I have no defence. How can I actually defend myself without having any actual proof to back it up? I have no cop investigations on me, I have no record of any targets that I may have had or any actions that I may have made. Which is why I'm having to resort to baseless exhortations of my innocence and rhetorical questions. I thought providing a background for my role, and a plausible and logical one at that would at least provide some sort of backing for my role, but it seems to have backfired(spectacularly). Nevertheless, I shall continue to fight to prove my innocence, however ridiculous my defence may seem.

To me, I think that it is fitting, for a bodyguard, but to be honest, what kind of idiot scum would claim as an Artemis Fowl character? That's my thinking, but whether you believe me or not is an entirely different matter.

Exactly. I may be a poor player, but neither am I scum nor am I an idiot.

Vote Count:
Nacht Jaeger - 2 (Heir of Elessar, Julius999)
Heir of Elessar - 6 (Pit_King, Littlefreak, Jax, Drinian, Frutfisk)

13 alive. 7 to lynch.

[This message has been edited by Catabre (edited 06-15-2009 @ 05:09 PM).]

I'm 100% sure there must be atleast 1 scum on the Heir wagon. Anyway, I suggest someone take a vote off, so we don't get a lynch without intent... I've seen it happen quite recently.

Frankly you'd have to be an idiot or scum to accidently lynch Heir right now. I'm no unvoting Heir because I still think his roleclaim is rubbish.

I'm 100% sure there must be atleast 1 scum on the Heir wagon.

Well, excluding Heir himself, 5 out of 12 players are on the bandwagon. So yeah, it's pretty likely.

If you want to look for bandwagoning scum I already pointed out that Drinian and Fruit are the two most guilty of bandwagoning (Drinian neglected to even provide a reason).

Could be worth a shot. I'm not really sold on Heir's guilt.

Unvote: Nacht
Vote: Drinian

We didn't lynch Gollum in Two Towers mafia and he wound up winning as the SK. Role names do mean stuff.

Well for 90% of the game I was town

Anyway, joking aside I’m a bit concerned that Julius voted Nacht after one more roleclaim, not providing any reasons just calling him 'scummy' and then after Jax pointed out he felt Drinian was bandwagoning he voted for Drinian for no given reason. Which I found very strange behaviour by Julius because normally he is so anti-roleclaiming especially when it's so unnecessary, and is very clear in stating his reasons for a vote, but on these two occasions he failed. Where I believe we have a very clear cut case on a lynch on Heir so I feel we have no more reasons to get another roleclaim or pressure somebody else.

So if Julius your voting Drinian for him not providing a reason for when he voted, you've more or less done the same thing on two occasions. Your vote on Nacht the same, the only reason given was 'he's seemed a little suspicious.' I don't think that just saying that warrants a vote.

So can you at least say why your not sold on Heirs guilt?
As at the moment from what I've managed to gather:

1) Heirs has claimed as a protective role that can't choose it's target (so rather useless) and could easily be riding on the towns concern over 2 dead protective roles and hoping we won't risk lynching another. Which is pretty much confirmed when he said this:

Quoted from Heir:

I think town would be better off at this stage by looking out for more scum rather than lynching a claimed protective role. At least as long as there are ways to confirm my role.

Which is basically somebody we are suspicious of trying to tell the town what to do. The last example I saw of this was you in Memento.

2) His defence also seems pretty poor (which you've admitted)

3) He's claimed an Artemis fowl role in a Lego Castle mafia? After which Catabre just hosted one. Coincidence?

4) He suddenly just voted Nacht, as a random vote after he claimed. Which surely can be seen as trying to deflect attention, and then you followed claiming Nacht to be a little bit suspicious. This is what made me a bit surprised at you Julius. Following the suspicious ones vote.

So therefore I'm leaning towards Heirs guilt, but won't vote now as I want to hear back from you first Julius. I'm also going to:

FoS: Julius for your actions after the roleclaiming of Heir.

And why your sudden move from Nacht to Drinian to?

Ah, at last something to talk about!

I’m a bit concerned that Julius voted Nacht after one more roleclaim

Actually I FoSed for Nacht before Heir claimed. However, the reason was unsubstantial (wanted to drum up some activity) and his explanation acceptable, so I've unvoted.

Which I found very strange behaviour by Julius because normally he is so anti-roleclaiming especially when it's so unnecessary

I don't currently think it's unnecessary. This game seems to be stuck in the doldrums and I'd like to at least look at another target before we go for Heir. I think we only have Heir still alive who has claimed anyway? So we're hardly exposing the entire town.

Where I believe we have a very clear cut case on a lynch on Heir

At the moment, I'm not seeing it. So far he's claimed Bodyguard, which is plausible given that there was another one. It isn't possible to test, but that's not really lynch justification in itself. Then there was the name which is a little odd, but again, hardly grounds for a lynch. Admittedly the Artemis Fowl stuff was ridiculous, but I can kind of see why he might have said it.

I'm also pretty sure we don't have anything he's done down as particularly suspicious, so unless there's something I've missed I don't see a pressing case against Heir.

you've more or less done the same thing on two occasions

The difference is I've been trying to spark at least some activity, while Drinian just jumped on a bandwagon.

Your vote on Nacht the same, the only reason given was 'he's seemed a little suspicious.'

I believe I said he seemed a little suspicious because he voted for Heir when it wasn't needed.

1) Heirs has claimed as a protective role that can't choose it's target (so rather useless)

True, but a vanilla townie is useless. Doesn't mean we actively seek them out for lynching. This is not a reason for lynching Heir, just a reason why we shouldn't be afraid of doing so if there is cause to.

Which is basically somebody we are suspicious of trying to tell the town what to do.

He's only "suggesting" it. We want him to give an opinion, no? He's hardly railroading us here.

2) His defence also seems pretty poor (which you've admitted)

Yes. But poor enough for a "clear cut" lynch? He waffled on about Artemis Fowl, not committed grievous sins against logic (which I would be suspicious of).

3) He's claimed an Artemis fowl role in a Lego Castle mafia? After which Catabre just hosted one. Coincidence?

Pretty sure Eoin Colfer didn't invent the name Domovoi.

and then you followed claiming Nacht to be a little bit suspicious

I FoSed Nacht before Heir's claim. I didn't suddenly switch and "follow" Heir.

4) He suddenly just voted Nacht, as a random vote after he claimed. Which surely can be seen as trying to deflect attention

Could be. But again, hardly solid evidence. It's not a scumtell I've ever really believed in.

And why your sudden move from Nacht to Drinian to?

Nacht's explanation was okay. Jax mentioned Drinian was on a bandwagon and I wanted to look at an alternative candidate to Heir. Ergo...

By the way, you're FoSing me. Did you forget I've been cleared by the Cop?

Actually I FoSed for Nacht before Heir claimed. However, the reason was unsubstantial (wanted to drum up some activity) and his explanation acceptable, so I've unvoted.

So suddenly just voting for Nacht simply calling him a bit suspicious is going to get some activity? What I’m doing now is getting activity. That’s not really going to get anywhere as you haven’t presented clear cut cases for Nacht or Drinian to defend themselves against or given the town any reasons why they should also put pressure on Drinian and not lynch Heir. So that was a pretty poor way of trying to get activity.

I don't currently think it's unnecessary. This game seems to be stuck in the doldrums and I'd like to at least look at another target before we go for Heir. I think we only have Heir still alive who has claimed anyway? So we're hardly exposing the entire town.

And if we go into the night with the mafia not knowing who anybody is and whose worth killing then we are in a very strong position. Going into the night even with just 1 roleclaim gives the scum knowledge whether they should nightkill him or avoid him. And with no protective role out there…

At the moment, I'm not seeing it. So far he's claimed Bodyguard, which is plausible given that there was another one.

Wait what? Not only is a bodyguard not that common a role, if somebody who has died has already been one then surely that makes the chance of there being another one less likely not more?

It isn't possible to test, but that's not really lynch justification in itself.

And I see no case against Nacht or Droideka for a roleclaim, but I see and by the looks of it a number of other people a reason.

Admittedly the Artemis Fowl stuff was ridiculous, but I can kind of see why he might have said it.

Going to keep why to yourself are we?

I'm also pretty sure we don't have anything he's done down as particularly suspicious, so unless there's something I've missed I don't see a pressing case against Heir.

Sadly this is something that could apply to most as this game has been so inactive, so theres bene very little to get from anybody.

The difference is I've been trying to spark at least some activity, while Drinian just jumped on a bandwagon.

Though your methods were awful.

I believe I said he seemed a little suspicious because he voted for Heir when it wasn't needed.

And you expect a game riddled with inactivity for people to have read and remembered this? Provide post references or quotes next time please.

True, but a vanilla townie is useless. Doesn't mean we actively seek them out for lynching. This is not a reason for lynching Heir, just a reason why we shouldn't be afraid of doing so if there is cause to.

No I meant that we’d already had 2 protective roles dead, one included that exact same role. Sorry I should have put more hint on the word protective. The useless part was just more of a even if we lynch wrong at least we’ve lynched a useless role as he can only protect randomly.

Yes. But poor enough for a "clear cut" lynch? He waffled on about Artemis Fowl, not committed grievous sins against logic (which I would be suspicious of).

In the circumstances of this game which has shielded little on everyone and combined with the other factors I’d say so yes.

Pretty sure Eoin Colfer didn't invent the name Domovoi.

Having never read Artemis or have a knowledge of Lego characters I wouldn’t no. But other people found this to be suspicious so I saw no reason to exclude it.

I FoSed Nacht before Heir's claim. I didn't suddenly switch and "follow" Heir.

No but it does look pretty suspicious when your vote rests on the same guy who is under all the suspicion. And you did place the vote stating no reasons in that exact post after heir had voted. Besides theres a hell of a difference between a fos and a vote. Imagine if I suddenly voted you now.

Could be. But again, hardly solid evidence. It's not a scumtell I've ever really believed in.

It’s a common scum tactic I’ve seen in mafia on HG. Especially in the less experienced players.

Nacht's explanation was okay. Jax mentioned Drinian was on a bandwagon and I wanted to look at an alternative candidate to Heir. Ergo...

Did you even look to form an opinion yourself on Drinian, or did you just trust jax?

By the way, you're FoSing me. Did you forget I've been cleared by the Cop?

Haha I was so hoping you mentioned this.
Lets see. Mapp mentioned his guilty on Tails on day 2, which must mean he got the guilty on him night 1, because if not he’d have done something about it on night 0. Makes sense?
Which must mean Julius, that Mapp got the innocent on you on night 0! Where you were a Vanilla Townie, when you died, and then you got replaced back in to a role unknown to us! So that cop result should be discarded as your old role was confirmed by the cop not your current one. But thanks for giving me an opportunity to make you look more suspicious, it’s rare you do that.

ABU, your last thing, maybe he didn't notice .

Oh I think Julius knows alright and hoped nobody else realized so he could spend the rest of the game with the defence of an innocent under investigation. He's not the type of player to not notice something like that.

If that's true I totally didn't realise - I had kind of pinned Julius down as acting weird when I pointed out that he wasn't normally for a many-claim strategy, but I didn't want to say a great deal because I was fairly sure he was town based on the cop result - "Julius did one thing wrong therefore I think he's a Godfather" doesn't really wash, after all.