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Topic Subject: The AoKH AI Scripting Ladder 2.0
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posted 12-15-11 04:01 AM CT (US)   


The AOKH AI Scripting Ladder


Welcome to the second continuous installment of the AoKH AI Scripting Ladder. Here you can enter your AI to compete aganist AIs with a wide range of abilities and a huge range of strategies. Whether it's to improve your AI's skill or whether you want to enjoy the exciting fun and community it provides, the AI scripting ladder will suit your needs.

How Do I Join?

If you want to enter the ladder, just drop a post in the thread with a link to your AI, tell us what civ you want it to play, and your AI will be added to the ladder.

If you are joining the ladder for the first time, we have listed some scripts that you can test your AI against in addition to the standard computer AI, so that you can know that your AI will be ready for the ladder. These scripts are Hispain Special, Chong Hong Wei, and Flash Myn. The first two are relatively easy to beat. If you can beat these two AIs consistently, then your AI is ready for the Ladder. If not, you can still join anyway. If you think you're AI is quite strong, you can test it against Flash Myn for a much stronger challenge. The links to these scripts are listed below the ladder standings.

When you enter your AI, it will play four unrated games against different opponents and given a rating based on its performance. Once your AI has been given a rating, your AI is ready to enter round play and climb up the ladder.

How Does the Ladder Work?

Like multiplayer ladders, the AI ladder determines an AI script's overall skill ability over the course of several games and compares the skill ratings of other AIs to each other. The biggest change from its previous installment is its use of a proper ladder ranking system with actual numerical ratings instead of a net win and loss ratio, which means that the ladder will be much more mobile, and beginning AIs will play against other AIs that match their skill much more accurately.

The AI Ladder uses the ELO system, the same system used to rank chess players or players on online gaming sites such as Voobly. The ladder is run in rounds. At the beginning of each round, each AI is selected an opponent by a matchmaking algorithm that will ensure that AIs play against other AIs with similar skills. The winning AI's score will be increased according to its opponent's score, either a large amount if the AI defeated a higher ranked opponent or a smaller amount if the AI defeated a lower ranked opponent. The losing AI's score is decreased in the same way. Once the round is over, a new one begins, creating continuous cycles of competitive fun.

AI Classes:

Each AI will is assigned a certain class depending on its current score:

Paladin - 1800+
Cavalier - 1700-1799
Knight - 1600-1699
Vassal - 1500-1599
Squire - 1000-1499


Game Requests:

Also, if you would like your AI to play against a specific AI in addition to the assigned games in the round, just post a request and the game will be played. The game affect the ratings of both AIs unless requested otherwise. Requested games are limited to one game against each AI per cycle.

Previous AI Ladder:

In addition, for those who like a bit of nostaliga, you can find the first installment of the AI scripting ladder here.







AI Ladder Champion


AI Ladder Champion:

Crusade - by Campidoctoris



AI Ladder Champion Hall of Fame:


The Horde
ARFFI De'gel
AgeofStoneWalls
Crusade

9 Sep, 2010 - 15 Dec, 2011
15 Dec, 2011 - 23 Feb, 2012
23 Feb, 2012 - 3 Mar, 2012
3 Mar, 2012 - present





Standings:


Paladins:
Rank:
-
AI Name:
-
ELO Rating
-
Civilization
-
Author
-
Download
-


Cavaliers:
Rank:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
AI Name:
Crusade
No Limits
ARFFI De'gel
Eagles Revenge
VNS_Halen
ELO Rating
1756
1747
1741
1741
1717

Civilization
Random
Huns
Aztecs
Aztecs
Vikings
Author
Campeador
TOAO_Dave
ARFFI
ER
VNS_None
Download
Crusade 4.41 - 14 Jun, 2012
No Limits - 12 Feb, 2012
ARFFI De'gel 1.65_2 - 19 Nov, 2011
Eagles Revenge 7.1 - 20 Jun, 2012
VNS_Halen - 29 Sep, 2004


Knights:
Rank:
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.
13.
14.
15.
16.
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.
22.
23.
24.
AI Name:
Vaisravana
The Horde
Solidus
Phyrexx
John Mendl
Leif Ericson
AgeofStoneWalls
Challenger
Lade
Chameleon
MiniEel
IS_Machine
CPS Alexander
Kamikaze
Brititron
Tlamacazqui
Snake
Barbarian
Kosmos
ELO Rating
1697
1681
1678
1670
1665
1662
1658
1649
1648
1645
1643
1642
1634
1624
1621
1621
1603
1601
1600

Civilization
Chinese
Random
Byzantines
Huns
Teutons
Vikings
Aztecs
Huns
Mayans
Random
Goths
Goths
Random
Vik/Jap/Teut/Goth
Chinese
Aztecs
Mayans
Random
Random
Author
java sparrow
zergs
java sparrow
robink
John Mendl
Leif Ericson
TOAO_DaVe
Clarty
Marathon
Scripter64
UnfairestEel
DuckOfNormandy
Suriel
The Ruler
cakemaphoneige
jdstankosky
UnfairestEel
II2N
Bari
Download
Vaisravana 1.5 - 9 Feb, 2011
The Horde 2.20 - 23 Apr, 2012
Solidus 1.1 - 21 Dec, 2010
Phyrexx - 31 Dec, 2010
John_Mendl vZL - 15 Aug, 2012
Leif Ericson 1.31 - 3 Jun, 2010
AgeofStoneWalls 2 - 19 Feb, 2012
Challenger AI 1.2c - 23 Aug, 2012
Lade 1.2 - 15 Jul, 2011
Chameleon - 2 Jan, 2012
Mini Eel 1.7 -20 Jun, 2012
IS_Machine 8.0 - 10 Apr, 2012
CPS_Alexander v4.9.1 - 19 Feb, 2012
Kamikaze V2.24 - 1 Feb, 2012
Brititron 1.8 - 2 Apr, 2012
Tlamacazqui - 15 Jul, 2012
Snake 8.4 - 23 Aug, 2012
Barbarian v1.9 - 11 Jun, 2012
Kosmos2.42 - 7 Dec, 2009


Vassals:
Rank:
25.
26.
27.
28.
29.
30.
31.
32.
33.
34.
35.
AI Name:
Boss
Wartron
Ace
Offwo AI
Promi
Integrity
AllianceThundaEmpire
Mire
Octopussy
Zarus
Storm!
ELO Rating
1596
1586
1569
1569
1556
1552
1534
1528
1511
1508
1502

Civilization
Random
Goths
Random
Random
Byzantines
Random
Random
Mayans
Random
Goths
Random
Author
lws735
cakemaphoneige
Alevo
offwo200
Promiskuitiv
Murray Jnr
Mabuse
kram1138
The Ruler
Lazarus II
Alevo
Download
Boss 4.01 - 17 Jun, 2012
Wartron v0.95 - 12 May, 2012
Ace 1.3 - 12 Apr, 2012
Offwo_AI v5 - 2 Jan, 2012
Promi 1.3a - 23 Aug, 2012
Integrity 2.1.8 - 8 Oct, 2010
AllianceThundaEmpire - 4 July, 2004
Mire v1.91 - 26 Feb, 2012
Octopussy V1.02 - 12 Jul, 2012
Zarus v4.6 - 30 Aug, 2012
Storm! v1.06 - 22 May, 2012


Squires:
Rank:
36.
AI Name:
Carlos Ferdinand
ELO Rating
1480
Civilization
Chinese
Author
Carlos Ferdinand
Download
CarlosFerdinand3 - 7 Mar, 2011


Testing AIs

Use the first two AIs to test whether your AI is ready to join the AI Ladder. Test against Flash Myn for a much more difficult challenge.

Chong Hong Wei | Hispain Special | Flash Myn





AIs Entering the Ladder:

AI Name:
Vermin Supreme


Fast 'n' Furious

UnfairSteel
Civilization
Huns


Mongols

Random
Author
Lazarus II


Dupemaster

UnfairestEel
Download
Vermin Supreme v1.6 - 6 Oct, 2012


Fast 'n' Furious 1.2 - 18 Sep, 2012

UnfairSteel 2.8 - 3 Nov, 2012
Game Opponents
Snake
Ace
CPS Alexander
Lade
Wartron
Kamikaze
Result
Loss
Win
-
Loss
-
-





Archived AIs:

AI Name:
Adder
ARFFI Eyries
Bothorth
Byzantine Nightmare
Caes Miro Parthius
ChiefofDs
Eclipse
Fire Dragon
Flixt
Hun Special
AI Name:
Imp_Caes_Miro
Island AI
James I
Megaflush
NightMare-Beta
Noob AI
Novelty
PK_Goths
Random Task
Ranger
AI Name:
Rattlehead
Red Star/Blue Star
RERE
Schottenclan
Serpent
SRN
UnfairestEel
Viking Special
WW-Teutons






Schedule:


Those who are willing to judge and record these games (anyone can judge a game), please post for which games you would like to play. Authors should not judge games that contain their own AI. All games should be played on Hard difficulty, Arabia, 200 pop, low resources. Games will be considered a draw if they last more than two hours, thus you can end the game after two hours if you wish.

As a change from the previous ladder, no special resign file must be loaded when running games. It is now the judges responsibility to quit a game if it goes over two hours. If at the end of two hours an AI has still survived but has less than two villagers and less than four soldiers, this AI will be considered defeated.

It is recommended that the judges cheat "natural wonders" so that there is no possibility of interference from the judge. However, if you feel that this would hamper your ability to review the game you may opt not to do this, as long as you provide the recorded game. As a special case, when playing a game with Chameleon, please chat 250 before Natural Wonders so those watching the game can know what strategy Chameleon will use.

Once the game is finished, please write a short review of the game. Provide helpful comments on what were each AI's weak points so that the authors of the scripts can know how to update them. Also post the recorded game link along with the review.To make it easier for us to gather information from the reviews, please post the reviews of the games in this format (just copy it into your post and edit it):

AI #1 (Civilization) vs. AI #2 (Civilization)

1 Jan, 2012 (this date is just an example of the format)

Review:

...
...
...

Winner: (AI Name)
Game Time: X:XX:XX (hours:minutes:seconds)
Recorded Game link


Thanks for judging and reviewing! Here is the current schedule. Sign up for the games you would like to play:

Season 1

Round 6


Requested Games:
 
1.
Challenging AI:
-

vs.
Defending AI:
-
Judge:
-
Winner:
-
Status:
Unplayed


Ladder Entrance Games:
 
1.
2.
3.
Entering AI:
Vermin Supreme
Fast 'n' Furious
UnfairSteel

vs.
vs.
vs.
AI Opponent:
CPS Alexander
Wartron
Kamikaze
Game Number:
3
2
1


Game
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.
13.
14.
15.
16.
17.
18.
AI #1:
Ace
AgeofStoneWalls
AllianceThundaEmpire
ARFFI De'gel
Boss
Brititron
Carlos Ferdinand
Challenger
CPS Alexander
Eagles Revenge
Integrity
Kosmos
Leif Ericson
MiniEel
No Limits
Octopussy
Promi
Solidus

vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
vs.
AI #2:
Barbarian
Chameleon
Mire
Crusade
IS Machine
Kamikaze (Japanese)
Zarus
Snake
Lade
John Mendl
Offwo AI
Wartron
Phyrexx
Vaisravana
VNS_Halen
Storm!
Tlamacazqui
The Horde
Judge:
Clarty
-
-
II2N
Promiskuitiv
-
-
zergs
-
Clarty
The Ruler
-
-
The Ruler
-
-
II2N
II2N
Winner:
Barbarian
-
-
Crusade
IS Machine
-
-
Challenger
-
Eagles Revenge
Integrity
-
-
Vaisravana
-
-
Tlamacazqui
The Horde
Status:
Played
Unplayed
Unplayed
Played
Played
Unplayed
Unplayed
Played
Unplayed
Played
Played
Unplayed
Unplayed
Played
Unplayed
Unplayed
Played
Played

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´

[This message has been edited by Leif Ericson (edited 11-03-2012 @ 11:45 PM).]

Replies:
posted 12-16-11 03:04 AM CT (US)     1 / 1052  
The revamped ladder is now operational. Let the games begin!

I have not checked every AI to make sure they're up to date. If your AI isn't up to date, just post a link below.

If you have time, please read through the entire thread, since there are a few other changes besides the rating format. Most prominent is that a ladder resign file is no longer loaded. It is now the judges responsibility to monitor the time limit. More details in the OP.

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´

[This message has been edited by Leif Ericson (edited 12-16-2011 @ 03:18 AM).]

posted 12-16-11 04:11 AM CT (US)     2 / 1052  
I'll judge Barbarian vs Flash Myn.

EDIT: Done

Barbarian (random => mongols) vs flash myn (mayans, obviously)

Barbarian did a very good fast castle, he was there in 18:12, with a smith and a range, delaying loom till end of dark and using the good mongol hunting.. Flash took a decent 19:30, with the same. Barbarian then went xbows/scorpions, and flash mayans went eagles/xbows. Things then turned bad for Barbarian. It prepared a great xbow rush but flash's eagles chewed it up. The lack of a 2nd tc for Barbarian allowed flash to outproduce in economy. Barbarian attacked again with the same result. Flash then counterattacked and ended the game.

Result: flash myn won.
Game time: 1:10

Recorded games (this includes integritys game as well):http://www.box.com/s/lgp7z8smdqm7x21xnq2h

[This message has been edited by offwo200 (edited 12-16-2011 @ 10:19 AM).]

posted 12-16-11 05:49 AM CT (US)     3 / 1052  
I'll test Promi vs AllianceThundaEmpire.

Crusade 4.42a. Every setting. AI compatible with UserPatch 1.1
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=10618
Xafaxarcos 1. The first chapter of my unfinished AI tutorial
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11317
posted 12-16-11 06:49 AM CT (US)     4 / 1052  
Never mind.

[This message has been edited by II2N (edited 12-16-2011 @ 06:50 AM).]

posted 12-16-11 07:50 AM CT (US)     5 / 1052  
Good luck Leif, I think you'll win this round
Go Promi!
I cannot believe that barbarian lost...

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-16-11 08:39 AM CT (US)     6 / 1052  
I expected Barbarian to win as well.
IMP_CEAS_MIRO vs Integrity (turks)

EDIT: Done

IMP_CEAS_MIRO did his usual suicidal 11' feudal in order to perform a fast trush. The only problem was that it failed to find the enemy in time, only about 17 min, which allowed Integrity to fast castle. IMP_Ceas miro had a large economic disadvantage and his troops were being eaten by m@a, not upgraded into longswords. However, miro at this point due to integritys random idle tc caused by escrow and the lack of wheelbarrow and bow saw, imp ceas miro, was in castle and back in the game. Both scripts started doing a slow boom and a possible crushing attack was launched by miro. Unfortantly, a well placed castle stopped it. integrity then counterattacked, and it was gg for miro.

Winner: imp-caes-miro
game time: 1:20
recorded game: exists but only on request since neither scripts are supported by scripters now

[This message has been edited by offwo200 (edited 12-16-2011 @ 09:28 AM).]

posted 12-16-11 08:58 AM CT (US)     7 / 1052  
I have an update for Ranger 3.04

To be honest, it's hardly any different from Ranger 2.9 in 1v1 tiny arabia, but it's use of escrow in this latest update puts an emphasis on eco, I expect it to win (sorry Leif)
Here's the link:
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11068

btw, it still uses the resign file. What's the point of making an already lost match go longer than it should?

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-16-11 10:15 AM CT (US)     8 / 1052  
Promi (Byzantines) vs. AllianceThundaEmpire (Random => Britons)

16 Dec, 2011

Review:

Both AIs tried a FC, being ATE much faster (17:09 aginst 19:47). But this was a bad idea, because ATE did it training only 28 dark villagers and accepting to much idle TC in feudal, so its eco became worse. So ATE only was training its third knight when Promi started its first.

Promi built its second town center and had a few more resources, it was evident that ATE needed to punish it with a strong krush (with knights from two stables) if he didn't want to lose. And it did, with very small numerical advantage, but with an all knights raid against a knights/xbows/spears army. Promi's soldiers were weaker, but they were playing at home, being reinforced with no stop, while ATE only had some knights attacking and some knights travelling to help their mates. So the home factor allowed Promi to resist the krush quite well.

Now it was Promi who had better numbers, although also thanks to its cheaper units, and a better eco thanks to its second TC. ATE also had quite idle TC because it didn't require any food buffer to knights. ATE's army had better untis anyway and attacked again after a good while, but the result was similar.

Once was a cler superiority Promi took the initiative and attacked ATE. The attack was rejected, but becoming ATE's economy quite damaged. Promi imperialed and ATE tried, but Promi made a second attack which devastated this superclassic. Yes, Promi won. :O

Winner: Promi
Game Time: 0:54:58
Recorded Game:
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=D2VMHGR5

I'll test Offwo against Kamikaze.

Crusade 4.42a. Every setting. AI compatible with UserPatch 1.1
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=10618
Xafaxarcos 1. The first chapter of my unfinished AI tutorial
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11317

[This message has been edited by Campidoctoris (edited 12-16-2011 @ 10:19 AM).]

posted 12-16-11 10:25 AM CT (US)     9 / 1052  
A krush with britons lol

Congrats on you victory Prom

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-16-11 10:42 AM CT (US)     10 / 1052  
Wow, nice Promi.
posted 12-16-11 11:20 AM CT (US)     11 / 1052  
Hi! The current ladder version of Chameleon is 20111130-042829, playing Random civ. Thanks!
posted 12-16-11 12:11 PM CT (US)     12 / 1052  
I don't find a Briton krush or Byzantines training knights instead of camels against an enemy heavy in knights, you can see it in a lot of AIs and can work well.

The most unusual thing that was once Britons built an archery, instead of xbows that trained cavalry archers!!! Ok, they also receive the Briton fast training bonus, but... The real reason is that ATE choose strats randomly, and a krush followed by late cav archers mix is less frequent for their Britons, but not forbidden.

Crusade 4.42a. Every setting. AI compatible with UserPatch 1.1
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=10618
Xafaxarcos 1. The first chapter of my unfinished AI tutorial
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11317
posted 12-16-11 03:19 PM CT (US)     13 / 1052  
Ranger (Mayans) vs Lief Ericson (Vikings)

Nothing, except perhaps a slight lack of sheep for ranger, notable happened until the feudal age. Lief reached the feudal age first and began preparing a flush. Ranger, only slightly behind detected the flush and prepared a counter flush. At this point, I must say I was amazed how similarly the two ai did. They both made armies of ranged units plus men-at-arms, a defensive tower, then at almost the same time began to stockpile for the castle age. But, because Lief's ranged units were skirms, I would have to say Lief is doing better, although this would become clear when Lief castled more than 5 minutes before ranger. Ranger, while still in the feudal age attacked at around 25'. Although hugely outnumbered, Lief's knights + lsm easily beat off the attack Lief attacked back around 30'. Ranger actually managed to beat off the attack, even though it mainly had only feudal units. Lief with its hugely superior eco went into unit mass production and attacked again shortly after. This time the attack broke through and Lief went on to win the game.

Winner: Lief

Game Time: 58:56

Recorded game: http://forums.aiscripters.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2491&p=45102#p45102
posted 12-16-11 05:59 PM CT (US)     14 / 1052  
Welcome to all newcomers!
Some won, some lost, but we are all having fun.

I wasn't surprised by the defeat of Barbarian. It may be a clearly better script than its opponent, but its attack system is optimised for fast melee units and not archery. Besides, Flash Myn is always dangerous and it's not the first time it beats a "better script".

I wanted to ask all judges of Chameleon games to chat 250 before typing natural wonders, so that Chameleon chats back its selected strategy.

I am preparing an all-civs version of Lade. It is already all-civs, but (a) it often hits the rule limit, (b) not all strategies are good yet, (c) I want to have at least some civs with 2 or more strategies before uploading, and (d) some strategies are optimised for one civ but work well with other civs, apart from the fact that research order needs to be changed for them.
posted 12-16-11 06:26 PM CT (US)     15 / 1052  
Slick, Leif.

Signed,
DaVe.

[This message has been edited by TOAO_DaVe (edited 12-16-2011 @ 06:26 PM).]

posted 12-16-11 07:43 PM CT (US)     16 / 1052  
GG Leif
I was over confident lol

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-16-11 08:58 PM CT (US)     17 / 1052  
I like the new ladder format. When I'm finished scriptiong my own AI I'll hopefully be able to add it to the ladder.

Man, Dann, you sure did wipe the... flor... with him on that one! BAM! OOO! ~ Aro
posted 12-17-11 04:01 AM CT (US)     18 / 1052  
Second opponents for new scripts added. Offwo, did Integrity win the game instead of Miro?

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´
posted 12-17-11 05:55 AM CT (US)     19 / 1052  
Offwo_AI (Random => Vikings) vs. Kamikaze (Vik/Jap/Teut/Goth => Vikings)

16 Dec, 2011

Review:

I'm not sure, but it seems that both AIs had less default dark woodcutters than needed for their strats, because I watched about 12 or more before the end of the age and they hadn't yet enough farms. Anyway it could have other reasons so don't change it if you don't see it repeated in more games (for example, in the case of Offwo it could be the unused barracks).

In any case Kamikaze feudaled in an ok time and Offwo a little too late (15:XX) despite to idle TC. It wasn't too problematic because Kamikaze had bad luck and his forward builder was discover before to finished his forward barracks, but it can be critical in other games.

Offwo castled in an ok time (about 20') which could be better if it wasn't because it was gathering unused stone (I imagined that it was reserved for a possible flush which was delayed because problems to build the first barracks).

But Kamikaze is agressive, and if it doesn't build its first barracks in a place it build it in another, and later more. It seems that Offwo prepared its weird spearmen strategy (with a few archers), which resulted inadequate for an enemy without cavalry, Kamikaze also had better numbers, so its violent trush didn't find any problem.

Winner: Kamikaze
Game Time: 0:36:50
Recorded Game: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=6L6NJENZ

I'll test Ranger vs Flixxt.

Crusade 4.42a. Every setting. AI compatible with UserPatch 1.1
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=10618
Xafaxarcos 1. The first chapter of my unfinished AI tutorial
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11317

[This message has been edited by Campidoctoris (edited 12-17-2011 @ 05:59 AM).]

posted 12-17-11 08:58 AM CT (US)     20 / 1052  
Offwo, did Integrity win the game instead of Miro?
Yup, sorry for the typo lol
posted 12-17-11 11:41 AM CT (US)     21 / 1052  
Wartron (Goths) vs Tlama (Aztecs)

The game started uneventfully and both ais castled shortly after 19'. Prety much nothing happened until Tlama attacked at around 26'. It appeared that Wartron had successfully defended, and even had destroyed Tlamas army a few times, but a steady stream of monks managed to break through Wartron's defenses. The destruction of 2 of Wartron's town centers signaled the end for Wartron.

Winner: Tlama

Game Time: 49:36

Recorded game: http://forums.aiscripters.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2491&p=45102#p45102
posted 12-18-11 03:31 AM CT (US)     22 / 1052  
Got it Kram. Wartron is now at the bottom of the ladder, which is quite interesting.

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posted 12-18-11 03:35 AM CT (US)     23 / 1052  
That is very interesting, and it won't last.

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-18-11 04:04 AM CT (US)     24 / 1052  
Yeah, it definitely won't.

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
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       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
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   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
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[This message has been edited by Leif Ericson (edited 12-18-2011 @ 04:14 AM).]

posted 12-18-11 10:09 AM CT (US)     25 / 1052  
"Promi (Byzantines) vs. AllianceThundaEmpire (Random => Britons)


Winner: Promi
"

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat unbelievable! Must have been really lucky!
I'll watch the replay right now! Mfw :OOOO

Thank you UnfairestEel and Kram!
posted 12-18-11 11:38 AM CT (US)     26 / 1052  
Ranger (Mayans) vs. Flixxt (Sarracen)

18 Dec, 2011

Review:

Both AIs tries a flush. Ranger with archers+spears changing later to archers+m@a while Flixxt with archers+trash. Flixxt stopped infantry training to castle jump when both had about 90 pop, so Ranger outnumbered it and attacked. Flixxt resisted well because its better unit selection but forward tower from Ranger allowed a tie.

Flixxt castled 8' sooner (30' against 38') but Ranger had a lot of military buildings so its military advantage disuaded it to attack. In fact it was Ranger who attacked more times, being every attack stoped but without losing numerical advantage. Once Ranger castled Flixxt had 3 town center, but when Ranger built its own TCs it still had military advantage, which was used again to attack its enemy, this time with upgraded units and taking the victory.


Winner: Ranger
Game Time: 1:08:56
Recorded Game: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=Y2D9DI0E

I'll test ARFFI De'Gel vs VNS_Halen.

Crusade 4.42a. Every setting. AI compatible with UserPatch 1.1
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=10618
Xafaxarcos 1. The first chapter of my unfinished AI tutorial
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11317
posted 12-18-11 11:49 AM CT (US)     27 / 1052  
Good job, UnfairestEel! Ranger's playing Flash Myn next.

I'll play Chief vs. IS Machine.

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´

[This message has been edited by Leif Ericson (edited 12-18-2011 @ 11:50 AM).]

posted 12-18-11 12:05 PM CT (US)     28 / 1052  
I would like to judge for the first time.
So there's Barbarian 1.4 against Byzantine Nightmare, when i want to download Barbarian there's his newer version 1.5.
Should i use Barbarian 1.5 then?
posted 12-18-11 12:16 PM CT (US)     29 / 1052  
Use 1.5. There are a good number of AIs that aren't up to date here. I've just asked everyone to check to make sure their scripts are up to date, since it would take a while for me to check them all.

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´
posted 12-18-11 03:42 PM CT (US)     30 / 1052  
Barbarian 1.51 (Random => Aztecs) vs. Byzantine Nightmare (Byzantines)

18 Dec, 2011

Review:

Both AI's advanced to feudal pretty evenly (Byzantine Nightmare being first (14:16 vs. 14:32)). Byz Nm then proceeded to train some skirms and spearman in feudal but didn't try to attack. Byz Nm built some forward-towers without any protection. Barbarian then castled at 18:29 and boosted his economy with a fast second TC, he also captured all relics while Byz Nm was still in feudal.

At 25:11 Byz Nm finally advanced to castle too, training more units and building more troop training buildings + forward-towers preparing for an attack while Barbarian trained spearmen, eagles and monks. When Byz Nm attacked Barbarian with mostly a few X-Bows+Skirms Barbarian was already researching imperial.

Barbarian was able to repel that attack very easily, finished imperial at 32:25, wiped Byz Nm's forward towers out and then decided to attack with a huge military superiority. He finished Byz Nm at 39:42, but the game was already decided when Barbarian could boom without having anyone disturbing him while Byz Nm trained some units but not doing anything with them. I couldn't see Byzantine Nightmare's strategy here but i'm also only an unexperienced player (and very unexperienced scripter too ^^).

Winner: Barbarian
Game Time: 0:39:42
Recorded Game: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=FD34MVR0

[This message has been edited by Promiskuitiv (edited 12-18-2011 @ 03:45 PM).]

posted 12-18-11 07:33 PM CT (US)     31 / 1052  
YAY!!! My first ever victory in the ladder!
Ranger is very persistent...
EDIT: wait a second, flash mayans is the one that beat Barbarian.

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php

[This message has been edited by UnfairestEel (edited 12-18-2011 @ 07:34 PM).]

posted 12-19-11 05:37 AM CT (US)     32 / 1052  
Flash defeated Barbarian in a standard match. You did it an a match to select your initial ELO. Ah! Barbarian only has lost ELO in its match vs Flash, not in yours.

ARFII De'Gel 1.65 (Aztecs) vs. VNS_Halen (Vikings)

18 Dec, 2011

Review:

ARFII tried its tipical FC while Halen a flush. Surprisingly Halen feudaled later and with more villagers. The flush arrived while ARFII was advancing to castle (which did it at 17:56!). But IMO it was a bad idea because both sides had almost the same number of soldiers, so the factor home was a key.

Halen stop more and more military production and advanced to castle (25:XX, nice time for a flusher), with the advantage of taking first the eco upgrades, but ARFII build more TCs, starting to take eco advantage. Halen decided to attack in more than one ocasion because this, waiting is a luxe when your enemy is training more villagers than you. But it had to do it with numerical inferiority, which was compensated by quality (knights against cheaper units). But numbers and factor home were enough defense for ARFII, which finally imperialed (Halen had also 3 TCs, but too late) and made a massive attack which destroyed Halen.

Winner: ARFII De'gel
Game Time: 0:50:59
Recorded Game: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=SQXYUFYD

I'll test Barbarian vs Phyrexx.

Crusade 4.42a. Every setting. AI compatible with UserPatch 1.1
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=10618
Xafaxarcos 1. The first chapter of my unfinished AI tutorial
http://aok.heavengames.com/blacksmith/showfile.php?fileid=11317

[This message has been edited by Campidoctoris (edited 12-19-2011 @ 12:03 PM).]

posted 12-19-11 01:03 PM CT (US)     33 / 1052  
I couldn't see Byzantine Nightmare's strategy
That's very natural, cos it has no for this game.
I want to replace it with Octopussy which (finally) plays random civ - don't expect it to win anyway.
Ah! and thanks to Leif for working out the new setup!

brandnew Ranger(blue) vs abandoned F1$Mayan (red)

so we see a clan internal argument to be solved in this arena

- the starting up is like my expection, so let's fetz
- the red had better farming and closer LC, the blue was lucky with hunting
- both went FC , both trained archers, who will be the better ?
- Ah, flash was faster, but didn't play out his joker, an early decision ?
- both only one TC, but Ranger with 4 ranges, is this the key ?
- 31 minute and the quarrel begun at a blue fb monastery, and the blue were faster there, so the red had the disadvantage and lost
- the blue archers kept the red clan under control and step by step they leveled the red clan down from the map, but for so long I didn't wait

Winner : Ranger
speeding 1.7 @fast
gametime about 1h
Mayan hassle

good job, unfairest(everseen)Eel

heav'n has no rage like love to hatred turn'd, nor hell a fury like a woman scorned (William Congreve)

[This message has been edited by The Ruler (edited 12-19-2011 @ 01:51 PM).]

posted 12-19-11 09:06 PM CT (US)     34 / 1052  
Thanks Ruler.

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-19-11 11:03 PM CT (US)     35 / 1052  
GJ UnfairestEel


Offwo_AI (Random => Franks) vs. AgeofStoneWalls (Aztecs)

20 Dec, 2011

Review:

Offwo_AI got the franks and is playing against the AgeofStonewalls aztecs. In the dark age Offwo built two mills (one next to deer̶ ) and hunted every deer in two different spots. By doing that he advanced to feudal at 12:10(!). I'm not sure about idle TC since i spectate with Gaia's (mother nature's) eyes. When AgeofStoneWalls reached feudal at 14:37 Offwo already finished building his blacksmith and market, but didn't mine gold for castle-age yet.

Wow okay now this surprised me (never seen that before), Offwo seems to have sold some resources to get the needed gold for castle-age and reached it at 16:41. AoSW followed at 18:14, at this time Offwo rushed with only spearman but AoSW could defend it's lumbercamp easily with it's own spearman and archers. Until now everything was really cool to watch and i was really pumped up for the rest of the game but then after Offwo's Spearman died and he didn't have any left he'd still go in 1 by 1 with every new produced one (against like 15 soldiers). This seems kind of bugged.

While AoSW boomed, Offwo still sent his spearman into battle 1 by 1 and still didn't mine any gold (i'm at 24mins atm and it's already evident that AoSW will win, the advantage is too big).
Well a few minutes later Offwo started to mine gold and added militiaman to his endless (and buggy?) invasion.

AoSW arrived at imperial at 32:18. And DAMN i forgot to turn relics victory off, i hope AoSW wins before that happens or this whole review was for nothing. Offwo researched m@a by now and AoSW is attacking. AoSW just wiped Offwo's town out and finished the game at 41:47 (happily before the relics would have finished the game).

Sidenote: Offwo's AI could be massively better when those bugs would be fixed, i'd be happy to see Offwo_AI when executing this strategy without those suicides.
Gamespeed: slow (+speedhack x2)

Winner: AgeofStoneWalls
Game Time: 0:41:47
Recorded Game: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=U6XT520C

PS: I saw that i'll play against Lade mayans next, version 1.0b has some minor bugs only when playing against mayan (cause at first my script flushed against mayans, but then i reverted it but hadn't found every rule when i released 1.0b so it probably behaves weird). I could fix this in a fast update before i play against lade but i'm working on a real update with some changes and i'd probably lose against lade anyway so i'll let that be for now. ^^
Not that my spirit is broken (not by any means!!! ;D), i just don't want to release a new version for such a small change solely.

[This message has been edited by Promiskuitiv (edited 12-20-2011 @ 07:31 AM).]

posted 12-20-11 05:10 AM CT (US)     36 / 1052  
anyway offwo script is buggy or not, if you can't kill AoStw very early on, then his EEWs wipe you from the map. Seems I'll take same fate with Octopussy.

Just wanted to play your game, Promi~ lol
no problem, we'll wait until you are ready.
(and BTW sheep, deer and fish have no pural s now and in future...)



Ranger 3.04 wants to win vs Willd Hun

as I once played Mayan NM in Hunnic Civ, I saw, that those did it in a more comfortable way, although I hadn't adj the gatherers
so I have little hope for Ranger this time and this feeling emerged as not betraying me.
both started at absolutely same conditions ( I seldom get this in my testings), so noone had a disadvantage caused by location.

Willd Hun prepared a horse/ archer combo, a fine decision vs Mayans, while Ranger believed in his archers.
Hmmm
damned Huns are so fast, Ranger hardely can follow once in CA, but Willd took his time - a chance for Ranger like the game before ?
Ah Huns slowly started their attack with a minor unit count - that could be fatal !
Oh ! No no that doesn't work for Ranger, no chance, even in that little quarrel he wasn't able to get the units at place ( middle map) intime and now more and more hunnic units got their order, knights, scouts and full x-bows did a masacer to the poor unsheltered Mayan archers and it was game over so very fast for Ranger this time

Winner Willd Hun
Game time 45 min
Speeding 1.9 fast
Mayans' doom

Ranger trained 4 swords in feudal - Why ? cost a hell of resources without any use
vs Huns you always can't go wrong with Skrimis and spears for the startup, but, bloody hell, the Huns sprint so fast



Octopussy(beta)

while working on Mayans I forgot to add the deleted attack rules, so Octopussy plays Mayan only until I get the attack rules working again - sorry

heav'n has no rage like love to hatred turn'd, nor hell a fury like a woman scorned (William Congreve)

[This message has been edited by The Ruler (edited 12-20-2011 @ 12:37 PM).]

posted 12-20-11 09:57 AM CT (US)     37 / 1052  
Still 100% lose against Lade but here is my 1.0c where i fixed some minor bugs like a forever lasting 2nd scout and some made some other minor adjustments. Should be a liiiittle bit better than 1.0b. Should be noticeable.

http://forums.aiscripters.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2555&p=44707#p44707 Byz of course

I'd judge Brititron against Flixxt next.

Edit: And thank you for waiting anyway

Edit2: And no worries Leif, i'll do bigger and less updates in the future so you don't have to change the data every week. ^^
But because this is my first AI and it doesn't exist for too long i do find some bugs from time to time (and sometimes i create new ones :>) which need a quick fix. But i hope it will get better.

[This message has been edited by Promiskuitiv (edited 12-20-2011 @ 10:01 AM).]

posted 12-20-11 10:18 AM CT (US)     38 / 1052  
I had just judged Promi vs Lade, but with the older version of Promi. I wont actually post it unless Promi would like me to.

Btw, Promi lost.
posted 12-21-11 02:59 AM CT (US)     39 / 1052  
Too tired to update the thread today, but Ranger will be starting with an initial rating of 1612.

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´
posted 12-21-11 03:24 AM CT (US)     40 / 1052  
Wow nice UnfairestEel!


And Kram & TheRuler, i appreciate that very much! But i'll take the lose, improve my AI over time and then try to work my way up. (:
So Kram feel free to post the review of my old version, the new one wouldn't change much except it might kill a few xbows more.

Edit: Promi's TSA doesn't work properly when the game speed is too fast (cheatengine). Well it works but only half of his troops would attack, the rest would wait a few mins more until the system finally reaches them. On Slowx2 are definitely no problems, when i played Slowx5 there were probs. :/

[This message has been edited by Promiskuitiv (edited 12-21-2011 @ 03:30 AM).]

posted 12-21-11 06:57 AM CT (US)     41 / 1052  
Whoa, a lot has happened in under 24 hours!
I geuss I have just been slingshot up the ladder lol. wonder how long that will last.
Thanks Promi!

My current AI project: Juggernaut

Want to get into some AI scripting for AOC?
See this site:
http://forums.aiscripters.com/index.php
posted 12-21-11 10:36 AM CT (US)     42 / 1052  
Thi sgane was played with an older version of Promi, but he said to post it anyways.

Lade (Mayans) vs Promi (Byzantines)

So, the game of course begins with the boring part (dark age) and both ais did okay. Then, near the end of the dark age, the game begins to get interesting. Lade had a clear advantage due to lack of sheep and farms on Promi's part. Both ais FC and Promi managed to partially catch up, due to a great feudal age. Lade castled around 19' and Promi was just a minute behind. Promi had an excellent early castle age and managed to almost make up the 400 point deficit it had accumulated in the dark-feudal age. The attack that came by Lade just after the 24' minute mark took that away. Promi only had a small army of knights and they were horribly outnumbered by Lade's xbowmen. In short, Promi's town was eventually leveled by Lade.

Winner: Lade

Game Time: 45:26

Recorded Game: http://forums.aiscripters.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2491&p=45102#p45102

Advice:
Promi: Farm earlier. It didnt start farming for quite a while. If you ever have extra wood after build the LC, why not build a farm. You wont use it for anything else and many farms take a while to build. Also it built its first MC waaaay away from its TC. Decreasing the sn-max-camp-distance will fix that.

[This message has been edited by kram1138 (edited 12-21-2011 @ 10:38 AM).]

posted 12-21-11 11:22 AM CT (US)     43 / 1052  
Hey
May i be in with the currently uploaded turneament version of IS_Machine?
posted 12-21-11 01:48 PM CT (US)     44 / 1052  
gg, promi!

I watched the replay. Lade had 131 pop (70 villagers) at 30', despite 17 casualties. 100 pop at 27:11 despite 13 casualties. Hit 18:45 castle-age. Very unusual figures.
Seems it was an optimal game for Lade. 4 stolen sheep, some close camps, limited crowding around gold allowed a perfect execution of the plan.
I've never seen such figures in my tests

As for Promi, its only mistake seems to be its decision to drop 2 lumbers before it starts farming. Most AIs drop 5-10 farms before 2nd lumber. This, together with lost sheep, hurt its plan. But the opponent had a perfect start, so there were no hopes.
posted 12-21-11 02:31 PM CT (US)     45 / 1052  
Lade had 131 pop (70 villagers) at 30', despite 17 casualties.
do you think, that this is possible with 1.0c ?
even with superbooming I never got more 110 at 30min

heav'n has no rage like love to hatred turn'd, nor hell a fury like a woman scorned (William Congreve)
posted 12-21-11 03:15 PM CT (US)     46 / 1052  
Ruler,
The game was 1.0c. So, since it happened, it must be possible.
I repeat that I haven't seen such figures before. The most I've ever seen was some rare ~140 by eagle rushers on michi, or ~150 by persistent flushers (Lade in FFA tournament, for example). But here we're talking FC.

I ran a replay with my current mayan strategy. Promi lasted a lot longer and it even unleashed a couple invasions. Seems that I need to spy my own script.
posted 12-21-11 03:23 PM CT (US)     47 / 1052  
gg wp marathon!
i watched it too now, no chance.

yeah i'll look into the lc problem, but don't have a good solution yet since i don't get escrow working.


you tested your current mayan strategy against version 1.0c i guess? because our match in the replay was with my 1.0b, it doesn't make a big difference but i improved my early defense (especially against mayans :P)
if so it wouldn't mean your current mayan strategy is worse than the old one. even if it is, it may be uniquely be true against promi :>

well, i just want to motivate you but since i don't know your new strat i can't say any more about this ;P
i'm curious about what it is ^^

personally i hope it's more exciting than a full x-bow rush ^^
i liked to see something strange and new like offwo_AI's fast castle technique, but i bet everyone of you knew that tactic and i was the only one who didn't : D w/e ^^

Wow i just realize how much worse my text looks when i don't use shift. ^^

[This message has been edited by Promiskuitiv (edited 12-21-2011 @ 03:52 PM).]

posted 12-22-11 03:22 AM CT (US)     48 / 1052  
Updated. BTW Promiskuitiv, the ladder resign file is no longer necessary. You don't need to load that file any more.

Duck, is 6.3 your current version? If so, the version in the ladder is up to date.

Now for my first judged game since August:

ChiefofDs (Random => Byzantines) vs. IS_Machine (Random => Turks)

IS Machine reached the Feudal Age first with a sub 14 min time. He started training scouts and archers while Chief went for his typical crossbow rush. Chief's attack reached IS Machine around 26 min. IS Machine had a few skirms by then, but it still took a bit of effort to defeat Chief's attack. After a while, Chief had an advantage in villagers because of a proper TC boom, while IS Machine continued to use one TC.

At 36 min, Chief attacked a mining camp with crossbows and a few cats, while IS Machine defended with a variety of spearmen, knights, and ranged units. IS Machine couldn't defeat Chief's squadron of archers, so it was gg from there.

Winner: ChiefofDs
Game Time: 0:50:22
Link


EDIT: Check the game review in my next post.

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´

[This message has been edited by Leif Ericson (edited 12-22-2011 @ 11:57 AM).]

posted 12-22-11 05:14 AM CT (US)     49 / 1052  
doesn't IS-machine play goths on the Ladder ?


novice vs experienced - hard game

Promi 1.0c vs Crusade 3.41 (-> Britons)

- again the starting loc was fair for both, sheep at once and possibility for deer hunting, not taken anyway
- late feudal for Promi, Crusade already 3 warriors in pocket
- soon the swords knocked at a house ahead the byz TC, but couldn't break the door
- meanwhile a nasty wolf forced them to return home for a while, gived (danm I mean 'gave') Promi some peace to adv to castleage
- meanwhile Crusade allocated a nice feudal army which wasn't content with this house only
- 2 byz knights trying to draw the invaders back, but clever Crusade added speares, so their live was short - RIP
- pesky british intruders suceesfully disvasted byz gathering for nice a while
- Crusade didn't renew the attack , adv to castle accumulating a nice army meanwhile, while poor byz tried to recover
- strong brit eco now pushing all kind of units, mainly LCav while byz with single knights and some monks at least no chance to turn the tables

Winner Crusade
time 53 min
speeding 3 @normal
feudal killer

FC (esp a slow 20 min) is risky if the enemy prepares a flush - I remember Zergs talking like " punsih FC strategy"

and one more

Lade 1.2 vs Solidus 1.1



- again the starting loc was same fair for both, sheep at once
- both prepared a feudal army, Lade usually more archers, Solidus more skirmis
- Soldus' fb tower didn't disturb the mayans, great luck
- but as soon as the mayans enlarged their Ts when going to castle ( 22th minute) their units can't resist to level it down
- that cost some archers's live and delayed Lade's dangerous rush
- Lade due to his archers faster in CA, but needed some time for his upgrades - very big chance for byz
- byz meanwhile in castle age, while Lade lost some villis ahead his town
- Lade now with fully upgrades x-bows and the rumble began ( 28th minute)
- OMG Solidus unexpected slow , still only feudal ups and the enemy ahead towngates
- waiting waiting, bloody hell, Solidus invested in booming - 3TCs and a pattern of farms, but .. no upgrades
- no wonder that his skirmis didn't resist the mayan archers, pikes and now Eskirmis for long time


Winner Lade (respect, mate)
time 56 min
speeding 1.6 @normal later fast
Solidus asleep

strange that Solidus was so tired this game, too much eco based - 28 min and no bodkin no E-skirmi is weak

heav'n has no rage like love to hatred turn'd, nor hell a fury like a woman scorned (William Congreve)

[This message has been edited by The Ruler (edited 12-22-2011 @ 08:13 AM).]

posted 12-22-11 11:48 AM CT (US)     50 / 1052  
doesn't IS-machine play goths on the Ladder ?
Whoops! Replaying now...

ChiefofDs (Random => Saracens) vs. IS_Machine (Goths)

IS Machine had an impressive sub 13 min feudal and started training men-at-arms. Chief advanced later and started training archers for his usual crossbow rush. However, ChiefofDs' farming rules seemed to be bugged since he stopped rebuilding them around mid-feudal. IS Machine attacked around 23 min with a fair amount of success, targeting a lumber camp. IS Machine advanced to the Castle Age around 29 min and attacked again around 37 min. Still in the Feudal Age because of the farming bug, Chief had no chances of defending himself.

Winner: IS Machine
Game Time: 0:47:22
Recorded Game: Link

~`o´~|\  Join the fresh and exciting AI Ladder for its fourth season!
´ `  |_\
       |    Learn the joy of AI scripting in my guide: The World of AI Scripting
______|______
 \        /
   .....Hinga Dinga Durgen! - SpongeBob
  `-=<.__.>=-´

[This message has been edited by Leif Ericson (edited 12-22-2011 @ 12:30 PM).]

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