Oh, I thought there was something wrong with my browser there.

Again, to me, Newt is definitely a marked man, there's no question of him getting away with this. Therefore, since we already have our lynch/vig target, why don't we discuss where the new kill came from? I'd like to see some discussion on my witch-hunter kill theory.

Also, Maeg is right, Newt is essentially a VT now, even if he's town. But that also makes EoJ more dangerous (provided Newt isn't lying), since he can block further protections etc.

Newt will not be all that much of a loss and I think we should lynch him today, but I don't see why people are trying to rush day when we would be better served with a bit more discussion.

Certainly there's no harm in discussing a bit further.

I personally don't see any reason to attribute the extra kill to the witch hunter. There's no proof that it wasn't him, but it seems just as likely, if not more so, that the mafia has a 1 shot kill in addition to their regular kill. Or, perhaps Newt was lying about his abilities and killed instead of protected.

Which would be stupidity in the extreme. If there's one thing we can be sure of, its that Newt(and any affiliates, if at all), had nothing to do with Beater's death. In fact, the person who killed Beater was looking to implicate Newt and maybe knew that, for whatever reason(through roleblocks, most probably), Newt won't be able to protect Beater.

I'm feeling more and more like it was the Witch Hunter, he would be the only one who wouldn't mind if his kill failed if the upside was that he could implicate someone, since he's already won.

Quoted from Night Post:

a three times iron survivor played by Minos Yewman

HEY! I had FIVE lives!

Quoted from Role email:

You can only be killed on your fifth kill

You were also lynched once, plus since you quoted the mod now, this'll be your 5th kill.

I don't think we should lynch EoJ today, I think it's between Newt and Ischenous.

Here is my reason for lynching Newt:
Was assigned to protect a player and that player died.

Here are my reasons for lynching Ischenous:
New kill appeared out of nowhere.
Has claimed a killing role.
Is only a survivor, (Since the black knight was one, I actually think he's an SK.) so we don't lose much even if he turns up as what he claimed.

Seems my reasons for lynching Isch are stronger, but I won't unvote. Who do you guys think we should lynch?

Oh, and now you post. Yes, mistype in the write up post has been fixed. Rest assured that you are dead.

The horrendous and inexplicable HTML rape in the main post has been fixed.

I don't see how claiming a survivor is something against me. I'm fairly certain that there's some pro-town players who claimed this. (Well, atleast EoJ, though I'm sure someone else did).

New kill appeared out of nowhere.

Doesn't mean it has to be me. Only one kill can be proven to be mine and that got a specific write up, like no other. There are other players you know.

I'm starting to believe that Newt is now anti-town, and I'm going to go with my gut feeling, because my gut is always right.

Vote: Newt Gunray
Vote: Newt Gunray

Well it's 8 to lynch. With my two votes, we only need one more person to make the final vote.

Does anyone want to make the final vote?

Oh, I disagree. Newt claimed a sort of Jock of all trades. One shot doctor, one shot cop, one shot roleblocker. He's expended every single one of those powers now, so we'd only be losing a VT.

Ah right, very well. Lynch newt and vig frenchie if he turns up town.

Yeeb. You missed my vote a long time ago.

Again, we know Newt is scum and we have our lynch target for the day, why do we have to be so intent to end day so quickly? Shouldn't we try to find where the extra kill came from?

We can let Newt remain 1 vote away from a lynch, to make him sweat.

Quite simply, Newt is practically dead, we have a chance potentially to find 2 scum today, we shouldn't waste it.

Quick! Discuss who the other killer could be before it goes to night!

Actually, Newt has been lynched as per ColdViper's missed vote. However, in the interests of fairness, I would ask Yeeb to discount the last chronological vote (one of Mephiles') due to the fact that he didn't know that he would be the hammer.
Just sayin'.

I'm sure it's Ischenous, if we have a vig he should vig him or EoJ.

Damn, saw it ages ago but thought I'd added it . Anyway, you guys get the award for shortest day ever.

That's disheartening. And we've still got two kills, which is highly problematic.

First things first. I have no idea who all has claimed and what they've claimed as. Well, I remember some claims, but I'm probably missing some. So let's start on a list. If you've claimed, and I've missed it here, please let me know what it was.

Ensemble Nut: Unknown
sneaky squirrel: Unknown
Brighty: Unknown
Maegereg: Unknown
THYMOLE: Unknown
EoJ: Frenchman (Roleblocker)
Mephiles: Dennis (alternating double/no voter)
Coldviper: Unknown
Osiris: Unknown
Ischenous: Witch Hunter (survivor)
Heir of Elessar: Unknown

No! Ah well, good luck town.

This isn't the best . But Aurthur probably wasn't any more use to us if he knighted all the knights.

However I think we ought to analyze the people who voted(Or rather reluctantly voted) for newt. One person in particular caught my eye.

Quoted from:HeirAgain, we know Newt is scum and we have our lynch target for the day, why do we have to be so intent to end day so quickly? Shouldn't we try to find where the extra kill came from?

We can let Newt remain 1 vote away from a lynch, to make him sweat.

Quite simply, Newt is practically dead, we have a chance potentially to find 2 scum today, we shouldn't waste it.

Frankly, his delay seems rather suspicious.

Which would be stupidity in the extreme. If there's one thing we can be sure of, its that Newt(and any affiliates, if at all), had nothing to do with Beater's death. In fact, the person who killed Beater was looking to implicate Newt and maybe knew that, for whatever reason(through roleblocks, most probably), Newt won't be able to protect Beater.

This was also funny. And of course the greater post as well.

'm feeling more and more like it was the Witch Hunter, he would be the only one who wouldn't mind if his kill failed if the upside was that he could implicate someone, since he's already won.

He was constantly trying to get the witch hunter lynched who wasn't half as important as the stuff we had on newt.

Quoted from: HeirAgain, to me, Newt is definitely a marked man, there's no question of him getting away with this. Therefore, since we already have our lynch/vig target, why don't we discuss where the new kill came from? I'd like to see some discussion on my witch-hunter kill theory.

Also, Maeg is right, Newt is essentially a VT now, even if he's town. But that also makes EoJ more dangerous (provided Newt isn't lying), since he can block further protections etc.

Newt will not be all that much of a loss and I think we should lynch him today, but I don't see why people are trying to rush day when we would be better served with a bit more discussion.

Once again. He's really trying to keep newt from being lynched. He's even throwing suspicion on EOJ who from my opinion is defiantly a survivor or else we would have had some french scuminess turn up this far into the game.

I think we should discuss where the extra kill could've come from. We already have our lynch target for the day, no need to rush things now.

And some more delay. For these reasons....

I'm going to Vote: Heir of ellesar

A Knight Of Ni, a Ni mafia member played by Newt_Gunray has been lynched.

This implies there is another mafia faction. There was no other group than the French. Before lynching anyone else, propose a different faction. By the way there were three knights of ni so they are probably dead...

Vote EoJ

Have fun guys D:

Quoted from CV:

Frankly, his delay seems rather suspicious.

Despite express reasons being provided as to why there should've been a delay?

Quoted from CV:

This was also funny. And of course the greater post as well.

Funny how you manage to ignore the non-bolded part which provides my reason as to why Newt wouldn't have targeted Beater. Those reasons still hold.

Quoted from CV:

He was constantly trying to get the witch hunter lynched who wasn't half as important as the stuff we had on newt.

Yes, and again, I provided reasons as to why the witch hunter should be lynched. He had a proven extra kill, Newt probably didn't. Newt could've been taken out in the night if we were convinced he was scum. The witch hunter might have night kill protection. Again, my reasons for wanting the witch hunter lynched over Newt still hold.

Quoted from CV:

Once again. He's really trying to keep newt from being lynched.

Ok, so I clearly state in the above post that I think Newt should be lynched today, but the lynch should not be rushed. Your inference: Newt should not be lynched.

Really?

Quoted from CV:

He's even throwing suspicion on EOJ who from my opinion is defiantly a survivor or else we would have had some french scuminess turn up this far into the game.

We had 3 less kills back then. And again, I don't see you disputing the reasons why EoJ could potentially have been a more major danger had Newt turned up scum. You're just debating the conclusion. If you have a problem with the conclusions, try debunking my reasons.

Quoted from CV:

And some more delay.

Again, I wanted the delay for more valid reasons. Yesterday, we would've had 2 more confirmed townies around to look for scum, make a decision. Maybe Henrz could've coordinated protection such that we could've had at least 1 kill by asking for protection on himself, letting the doc know if he considered himself in danger. Fact is, thanks to all that rushing, we have less to go on today than yesterday, and less people that we can trust.

Newt was practically dead, no one would've listened to him at all. We could've just ignored him, maybe used the day to find more scum to take out today. Now, we have put ourselves at a disadvantage, all to lynch a man who was already practically dead.

Also, Thymole, you need to be a bit more clear with what you're saying here.

And again, I don't see you disputing the reasons why EoJ could potentially have been a more major danger had Newt turned up town.

Fixed.

I think today we should lynch Isch today. He probably is the cause of the extra kill. Also, he is a survivor. We don't really lose much by lynching him.

Vote: Ischenous

I suppose you don't look too bad....I'll Unvote:Heir until any furthur evidence shows up.

Any idea how long has Brighty not posted for?

I'm a bit peezed that Ensemble didn't kill someone (isch, EoJ) last night.

I'm sure it's Ischenous, if we have a vig he should vig him or EoJ.

Pretty obvious and it raises some suspicion. Unactiveness more likely.

This implies there is another mafia faction. There was no other group than the French. Before lynching anyone else, propose a different faction. By the way there were three knights of ni so they are probably dead...

Vote EoJ

I suggested this a while ago, no one liked the idea of it.

I think today we should lynch Isch today. He probably is the cause of the extra kill. Also, he is a survivor. We don't really lose much by lynching him.

Vote: Ischenous

Chances are EoJ has a kill, and Isch does not. Lynching EoJ today and having Ensemble kill Isch tonight is good.

Sudo Vote: EoJ
(I'm going to wait until Ensemble confirms it this time)

(It took more then two minutes to type that up, FYI)

Wow, that was some nice timing by Brighty.

Could someone post clearly as to why we're going for EoJ? Its 2 in the morning and I'm a bit fuzzy, so have no idea.

a Ni mafia member

This specifies that there is a ni mafia. Logically there must also be another mafia if this specification is to make sense. Also logically, there are no other notable groups within the holy Grail that are seen as evil. There might be other characters from different sketchs, but an entire mafia from another sketch is highly improbable. Therefore, unless another possibility is given, the French must be the second mafia group.

He is also a roleblocker...

Thanks, that explains it a bit, lets see what EoJ has to say to that.

That makes sense, so I'll Unvote.

This implies there is another mafia faction. There was no other group than the French. Before lynching anyone else, propose a different faction. By the way there were three knights of ni so they are probably dead...

a) No, a Head Knight of Ni is confirmed as a role, as he's already got one victory condition with the death of the shrubber. There's at least one more Ni Knight about, though it's probably the last (head) one by now.
b) Yes, it does imply. But, no, it doesn't. Mostly because if it was wanted to be made clear that it was one faction of many, how come it hasn't turned up any other time a Ni knight has died? Hm? Looks to me Yeeb's just done a different wording, and you're going for me pretty much on a piece of wording by the host, which isn't even flavour. So nice, but wrong tree.

I suggested this a while ago, no one liked the idea of it.

Yes. Quite why anyone should like it now any better is beyond me.

Chances are EoJ has a kill, and Isch does not. Lynching EoJ today and having Ensemble kill Isch tonight is good.

You say things, but offer no point of proof to back up how you've come to the conclusion of me having a kill. Or indeed Isch being scum. You've done this before, after I had to defend myself the first time, I challenged you to put evidence down on the table that cut through my defence, and you shut up and lurked from pretty much then on.
Go on, change the habit of a game. The only reason why I haven't gone for you in-game is because I blocked you one night and we still had the same number of kills.

This specifies that there is a ni mafia. Logically there must also be another mafia if this specification is to make sense. Also logically, there are no other notable groups within the holy Grail that are seen as evil. There might be other characters from different sketchs, but an entire mafia from another sketch is highly improbable. Therefore, unless another possibility is given, the French must be the second mafia group.

See above point on how come the wording hasn't appeared anywhere else.

He is also a roleblocker...

I'm 3rd party- a survivor. The previous survivor we uncovered, a certain Black Knight, had the three-times iron trait, indicating that survivors are given roles to help them along to achieve their conditions in what is a quite large game when it comes down to it for a survivor to survive.
It's perfectly feasible for a town to have its own RBer, of rather stronger loyalty to the town than a survivor is. Unfortunately for Yeeb I've been playing it pro-town

Now. That contemptuously swatted aside, might I add that the second kill has consistently been one that has been in the style of 1 person doing the beating? For example, the death of CharieDog/WRP (Can't remember which) mentions killer in the singular, and implies more than one person beating up the other. So you have a 2-person and a 1-person lot of people. We've killed a Ni knight, and it appears that both sets of kills tonight are done by one person- Hands can indeed be interpreted either way as we have two hands each, but still, it fits.
So I rather doubt there is a second mafia. I'm open to any sign of proof, like, y'know, a dead person of a second mafia, but all deaths have been either killer rabbit or Ni. So I'm thinking no.

As for the second kill, might I suggest the Bridge Keeper? He's not turned up yet, yet is on the main post... the rest of them up there have turned up in various capacities...

Anything I've missed, please highlight for me to address, and let me answer- I've got A Levels so I might be a bit slower than usual. None of this "Yeah, I think EoJ is scum! VOTE EOJ!" thing, please, that's just crappy play and will not help you guys win.

I'll wait until this has run out of steam before I voice my suspicions.

See above point on how come the wording hasn't appeared anywhere else.

Also, see below (that sentance) for why I doubt there is a second mafia.

@Coldviper's Post 1571:
Heir maintained that Newt should be lynched, and spending more time trying to find scum is hardly a scummy move. Nowhere did he suggest not lynching Newt. His fascination on Ischenous is rather strange, but it attracts attention more than anything else. I doubt he would continue with it as mafia given the lack of general support. I don't suspect Heir at the moment.

@THYMOLE's Post 1572:

This implies there is another mafia faction. There was no other group than the French. Before lynching anyone else, propose a different faction. By the way there were three knights of ni so they are probably dead...

Vote EoJ

As someone else mentioned, the Ni leader is still at large. If you want to lynch EoJ, please cite some behavioral evidence where's he's acted not-town. You don't know for certain that there's no other group but the french. Your argument works equally well from the other side: "if the french are a mafia, why haven't we seen more French?"

@Brighty's Post 1579:
See above.


I'd like to renew my request that anyone who I missed who's already claimed remind me what their claim is.

If you want to lynch EoJ, please cite some behavioral evidence where's he's acted not-town.

He isn't town, that's the thing.

Guys, I've been waiting to throw this baby for SO LONG right now. I just know that it's a baad idea to throw this and hit a town, so I'm going to wait. Though hitting Isch sounds like a good idea.

I still say there is little reason to go for me, all of the suspicousness (that I remember, if I missed anything out tell me) can be explained. There is only one kill which can be connected to me that makes sence, which I owned up to. The kill I owned up to is themed round this role, no other kill is. You say 'I'm only a survivor' but since I've shown it's uinlikely I have any other kills, you are basicly going to waste a kill on a VT. If you're going to kill me, please come out with some solid evidence are points.

His fascination on Ischenous is rather strange

I think it's partially because I killed his previous role, so he seems reluctant to believe I'm not anti-town. Atleast that how it appears here. I see why he is though.

What was that? A lame gamble that I would be too lazy to check your claims EoJ? This is not new wording, it is consistent. You are not cleared. You are not town. You are a roleblocker. And you have quite possibly the scummiest possible role.

A Knight Of Ni, a Ni mafia member played by Guard Of Olympus has been lynched.

As for there being at least one more knight of ni, I stand corrected.

I propose lynching EoJ and vigging Isch

As someone else mentioned, the Ni leader is still at large. If you want to lynch EoJ, please cite some behavioral evidence where's he's acted not-town. You don't know for certain that there's no other group but the french. Your argument works equally well from the other side: "if the french are a mafia, why haven't we seen more French?"

As far as the town is concerned, most of our lynches have been based off of probable cause not fact. Furthermore as there have not been any French mafia members exposed yet he is free to pretend to be town for his own benefit. If French mafia, he would have no connection to the ni.

As for why we have not seen anyone else French, it could simply be that we are not lynching an obvious target...?

Continuing, there are two kills occuring still. With the head knight of ni one of the two is accounted for. If isch turns up killess then we have good reason to blame the French.

Additionally, if any of you have seen the movie, aren't the French the ones who are actually holding the Grail in castle Aaagghhhh...? They are not survivors such as the black knight, they are enemies

As far as the town is concerned, most of our lynches have been based off of probable cause not fact.

So you're citing the fact that we haven't had much evidence in the past to cover for the fact that you don't have a shred of evidence to back your claims?

Furthermore as there have not been any French mafia members exposed yet he is free to pretend to be town for his own benefit. If French mafia, he would have no connection to the ni.

Let's examine this theory of the French mafia. According to you, there's another mafia out there that we've somehow missed. We have a grand total of 11 people left alive. If we assume roughly the same size as the other mafia, that's 4-ish people. So you're seriously suggesting that we have a mafia so accomplished that they've managed avoid having any one of their four members killed off when more than 60% of us are dead? And that we're now dealing with 5 mafia and 6 townspeople? If you're right, then hunting down the french is the worst possible thing we could do, because we'd still keep getting hit by two kills per night.

As for why we have not seen anyone else French, it could simply be that we are not lynching an obvious target...?

There's still several other members of his mafia to account for who should have showed up by now. And let's not forget, the Ni mafia clearly doesn't believe that the French are another mafia group, or EoJ would have been toast long ago.

Continuing, there are two kills occuring still. With the head knight of ni one of the two is accounted for. If isch turns up killess then we have good reason to blame the French.

First off, Isch is killess. I imagine EoJ might be able to attest similarly. Second, you've no more proof that the kill is coming from the french than Heir does that it's coming from Isch. You're essentially saying "there's an extra kill, so there must be a French mafia, and thus EoJ must be scum." There's no actual proof anywhere in that tenuous chain of reasoning, only speculation and wild accusation.

Additionally, if any of you have seen the movie, aren't the French the ones who are actually holding the Grail in castle Aaagghhhh...? They are not survivors such as the black knight, they are enemies

Well, it's unclear that they actually have the grail. But more importantly, the Black Knight tries to kill Arthur, and he's neutral in this game. Dennis hates Arthur, and yet he's (presumably) a townie. There's clearly no correlation between stance in the movie and alliance in the game.

I think it's much more likely that we have another serial killer type on the loose. That would account for the fact that we've failed to kill anyone from another mafia up till this point. I think we might also have another couple Knights of Ni, because honestly a four person mafia in a 18 person game is a little small. And may I point out how few people we've apparently pressured? You'll note that in my list from the beginning of the day, I can only list three people who've roleclaimed. Perhaps the reason that you find EoJ and Isch's claims most suspicious (and honestly, you're basing off of nothing but claims) is because there's only one other person who's claimed.

He isn't town, that's the thing

Awesome, so you're reverting to type. Go slink away.

What was that? A lame gamble that I would be too lazy to check your claims EoJ? This is not new wording, it is consistent

What? Go back to every time we lynch a Ni knight or one gets killed. We get "A knight of Ni" has been killed, not "Of the Ni mafia" or whatever. You are being lazy, my friend, or downright misleading.

ou are not town. You are a roleblocker.

Yep. So where does the kill come from if I RB? Hm?

nd you have quite possibly the scummiest possible role.

No one has yet to penetrate my previous flavour arguments. Have you come up with something new? Share it with us, otherwise you're not going to convince anyone.

Furthermore as there have not been any French mafia members exposed yet he is free to pretend to be town for his own benefit.

Oh, please, aside from anything else, look at the numbers. Even if you were right, it would be unbalanced for there to be another mafia with the Ni mafia being 4-man and two 3rd party roles in the guise of the Black Knight and the Rabbit. You know I'm right.

As for why we have not seen anyone else French, it could simply be that we are not lynching an obvious target...?

That's not a reason. That's almost gambler's fallacy.

Continuing, there are two kills occuring still. With the head knight of ni one of the two is accounted for. If isch turns up killess then we have good reason to blame the French.

Additionally, if any of you have seen the movie, aren't the French the ones who are actually holding the Grail in castle Aaagghhhh...? They are not survivors such as the black knight, they are enemies

You've ignored my flavour arguments. Again. Black Knight was more likely to be sk, as he actually fought Arthur. French sat in a castle all day, and were attacked. The fact they have the grail is irrelevant. They didn't even deal lethal damage.

As for where the kill comes from, Bridge Keeper. You've ignored segments of my posts.


By the way, you know what's the best bit about this? I blocked Isch. Sorry I didn't mention it before, I had a wee bit of trouble having to defend myself. So the kill doesn't come from him .

That rules Isch out then if EoJ is telling the truth. Dammit.
Its just that I had a fantastic role as the Witch and was really backing myself to win it, so was really angry that I got NKed.

Didn't GoO claim as the Bridge Keeper? Why is EoJ repeatedly referring to him?

Can anyone glean from the write-ups as to who could be making the second kill?

For this day's writeup, the only bit of important flavor is this:

As he walked past a dark alleyway, hands shot out and grabbed him. His muffled screams were not audible and he was dragged to his death.

That was from the killing of Sir Galahad. For the King Arthur kill there's not much flavor. I'll check back and see if I find anything more.

This is what the writeups confirms:

The black knight was vigged by one of the King's knights. (Who was it again that was a vig? I don't remember.)

Sir Gawain was killed by a knight of Ni.

Patsy was killed by a knight of Ni.

The Witch was killed by the Witch Hunter.

Roger the shrubber was killed by a knight of Ni.

Sir Lancelot was killed with a "golden arrow." Who is an archer in this movie?

The Sir Lancelot kill might give us the clue as to who is responsible for the other kill.

@eoj I am on a phone and have little power. Can't rebuttle much YET. However I liked that part where you called me lazy, said that the wording has never occured before, and then ignored the quote right below my argument in which I proved myself right. Olympus and newt both had it.

With the arrow and the "other" kills it sounds like a Jack of all trades survivor IMHO.

The only instance I can think of a bow and arrow being used is whats-his-name - the son of that guy who built the castle in the swamp. It kind of fits, as he shot Lancelot's "horse" and could therefore be construed flavour-ally to be anti-town.