[Group Project] "Age of Antiquity" - Age of Empires III Heaven Forum

Topic Subject: [Group Project] "Age of Antiquity"

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Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 07-09-06 05:44 PM EDT (US)

Inspired by these two threads:

What do you think about a Re-make of Age of Empires 2?

AOE4: AOE1 Remake Ideas

What I'd like to do is launch a GROUP PROJECT for anyone on the forums to join. This will be a complete overhaul and remake of the first Age of Empires. Not only a remake, but an overhaul. What does that mean? Well that means we will go deeper into historical gaming than any game Ensemble has yet produced. We will update AOE1 to modern standards of gameplay as well. Each civ will be unique and fresh and most of all historically accurate.

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What each project member will do is choose 3 civs from the list below to design as he or she sees fit, within the guidelines of the game as I will set up. What you will do then is research each civ to the best of your abilities, fill out the form I provide here and post it in this thread. Be careful not to be too verbose in your design because the forum seems to not like large posts. When everything is done and all civs have been profiled, I will gather everything together and make a giant new thread releasing the game design to the world.

This thread will be for strictly signing up for civilizations to profile (and then posting your results) and for discussing gameplay mechanics of the game and civs. What we want to do is stick to history and stay away from mythology and religion, except when dealing with Temples and Healers/Priests.

I fully expect this to last months, but that's not important. What's important is we all have fun making this and learn more about game design, history, and how they both fit together!

-------------------------
Okay, first, the uber LIST OF CIVILIZATIONS! Choose three from below you'd like to profile (first come first serve). *Note, please choose Vanilla civs first, then move on to the expacks (don't everyone try to gang up on the Greeks and Romans):

Vanilla: "Age of Antiquity: Dawn of Civilization"
- Assyrians :: Mythos_Ruler
- Babylonians :: Empror
- Egyptians :: Cassador_Chris
- Etruscans :: Brocktree101
- Hebrews :: Yamato Take
- Hittites :: Empror
- Kushites (Nubians) :: Empror
- Minoans :: Mythos_Ruler
- Mycenaeans :: egel
- Phoenicians :: GatoFedorento
- Scythians :: Dieneces
- Sumerians :: GatoFedorento

Chocolate: Expack1 "Empires Ascendant"
- Carthaginians :: Yamato Take
- Gauls :: egel + Brocktree
- Hellenes (Greeks) :: Dieneces
- Iberians :: GatoFedorento
- Macedonians :: Mythos_Ruler
- Numidians :: Yamato Take
- Persians :: Mythos_Ruler
- Romans:: egel
- Samnites :: Mythos_Ruler
- Seleucids :: Hosko
- Syracusans :: Empror
- Thracians :: Dieneces

Rocky Road or Strawberry: Expack2 "Empires Besieged"
- Axumites (Ethiopians) :: skystrider
- Britons :: Egel and Brocktree101
- Byzantines (Eastern Romans) :: Empror
- Dacians :: Mythos_Ruler
- Germanians :: Brocktree101
- Han (Chinese) :: MudokonGod
- Huns :: GatoFedorento
- Indians :: Lord Iarune
- Palmyrans :: GatoFedorento
- Parthians :: Empror
- Sarmatians :: egel
- Yamato (Japanese) :: Yamato Take

-------------------------
Next, choose your Civ Bonuses. Bonuses are things like, "Archers +25% HPs" or "Farming 33% more profitable." Please, stick to realistic bonuses for your civs. Make them historically accurate, and again, bonus points to those who come up with original ethnic names for your bonuses.

Bonus 1 - Economic/Civic
Bonus 2 - Military
Bonus 3 - Any

--------------------------
After that, choose the units your civ will field in battle. The research part will be this: Choose units that your civ used in REAL HISTORY. For instance, the Babylonians did *not* use a Quinquireme. However, you can give them a "bireme" class ship for gameplay purposes. The fun part will be finding the NAMES OF EACH UNIT according to the civ you are profiling. For instance, a Greek Infantry Spearman is a Hoplite (hop*lee*tay). Bonus points to those profilers who can give each unit a unique ethnic (non-anglosized) name.

Out of the 33 unit types listed here, I'd recommend your civs have no more than 30 and no less than 20:

Villager Citizen/Peasant (jack of all trades, builder and gatherer)
Villager Slave (a quick gatherer, does not build)
Villager Colonist (a quick builder, does not gather)
Villager Merchant (land trader)

Infantry Militia (every civ; very first military unit; starts as clubman in Stone Age)
Infantry Spearman
Infantry Swordsman
Ranged Slinger (very first ranged unit; starts in Tool Age)
Ranged Skirmisher
Ranged Bowman
Cavalry Scout (very first cavalry unit; can hunt; starts in Tool Age)
Cavalry Spearman
Cavalry Swordsman
Cavalry Skirmisher
Cavalry Archer

Healer Priest
Spy/Assassin/Diplomatic Unit

Siege Stone Thrower
Siege Bolt Thrower
Siege Tower
Siege Ram

Ship Fishing
Ship Trading
Ship Light -> Ship Medium
Ship Siege(rare "super" ship)

Unique Civilian Unit
Unique Military Unit 1
Unique Military Unit 2

Hero 1 (every civ has at least one hero)
Hero 2
Hero 3
Hero 4 (few civs have 4th hero)

*Note: Chariots and Elephants are usually reserved as Unique Units.
*Note: Make Unique Units truly UNIQUE, SPECIAL, and ELITE. For instance, a Hoplite isn't unique (he's just a spearman), but a SPARTIATE is an ELITE form of hoplite that would work well as a UU.

--------------------------
Next, profile the buildings for your civ. The fun part will be, again, to find out ethnic-specific names for each one. Also fun will be to come up with truly special Unique Buildings (listed at the end):

Town Center (upgradeable with different features, like in Battle for Middle Earth II)
Government Building (researches unique techs and "uber" post-Imperial techs, plus trains Unique civilian unit)
Market
House
Temple
Storehouse (gather wood, stone, and gold)
Mining Camp (generates gold like AOE3's Plantation)
Granary (gather food)
Farmland
Livestock Pen (like AOE3)
Outpost Tower
Palisade Wall
Palisade Gate
Stone Wall
Stone Wall Tower
Stone Wall Gate
Emissary (build at Mercenary camps to train mercenaries)
Smith (armory technologies)
Barracks (infantry)
Archery Range (ranged)
Stable (cavalry)
Siege Workshop (siege)
Naval Yard (ships)
Citadel (fort - build limit: 1)
Academy (trains Unique military units)

Wonder (give it a name and a unique bonus)

Unique Building Economic/Civic
Unique Building Military
Unique Building 3 (only a few civs have 3rd Unique Building)

------------------------
Lastly, choose the Unique Techs for your civ. You get one Unique Tech for each Unique Unit or Unique Building in your civ's profile. For instance, if you have 2 Unique Units and 1 Unique Building, then you get 3 Unique Techs.

Unique Tech 1
Unique Tech 2
...
Unique Tech 6 (Max number, based on max number of UUs and UBs)

-------------------

Don't worry about getting the "format" right. You don't have to do things IN THAT order. You can also easily copy/paste the lists provided above and work from there.

Alright, the floor is now open. Once someone completes his/her 3 civs, that person may then choose 3 more to complete! We have 30+ civs, so lets get going!

MYTHOS RULER
~ :: Modder of the EPIC TERRAINS MOD :: ~
~ :: Scn Designer of "Peloponnesian War" for AOM :: ~
~ :: Download Centurion_13's (ESO compatible) Hoplite Mod for AOM :: ~
~ :: 0 A.D. - a new Freeware RTS from Wildfire Games :: ~

[This message has been edited by Mythos_Ruler (edited 08-02-2007 @ 06:37 PM).]

Author

Replies:

Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 07-28-07 00:13 AM EDT (US) 901 / 929

I'll update the techtree with some examples, then upload it to AOE3H.

Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 07-28-07 02:04 AM EDT (US) 902 / 929

The Samnites

Bonuses:
Bonus 1 :: "Gold and Silver"
- Gold mining bonused +20%.
Bonus 2 :: "Uncanny Horsemen"
- All Cavalry +20% attack and speed. Samnium was a mountainous country, nevertheless, they had excellent cavalry, which were used by Hannibal during his campaigns in the south of Italy.
Bonus 3 :: "Manipular Tacticus"
- Unique Formation: The Maniple (Age 4). The Romans would copy this formation after it proved superior to their own phalanx.

Units:
Villager Citizen/Peasant :: Touto (Age 1)
Villager Slave :: Graeci (Age 2)
Villager Merchant :: Emporo (Age 3)

Infantry Militia :: Clubman (Age 1) -> Axeman (Age 2) -> Touto Levy (Age 3)
Infantry Spearman :: Hastae (Age 2) -> Hastae Posterior (Age 3) -> Hastae Prior (Age 4)

Ranged Slinger :: Fundito (Age 2)
Ranged Skirmisher :: Manipularo (Age 3) -> Manipularo Posterior (Age 4)
- Throws the Pilum, which is copied by the Romans later.

Cavalry Scout :: Speculatoro (Age 2)
Cavalry Spearman :: Campano (Age 3) -> Apuliano (Age 4)

Healer Priest :: Flamo (Age 2)
Spy/Assassin/Diplomatic Unit :: Imperator (Age 3)

Siege Stone Thrower :: Graeci Oxybeles (Age 3)
- A siege engine bought from the Greeks.
Siege Ram :: Aries (Age 3)

Ship Fishing :: Navis (Age 2)

Unique Civilian Unit :: Biremiso (Age 2)
- A heavy trade ship with self-defense capabilities (can easily defend itself against a Light Warship). Also bonused +5 garrison slots for increased transport ability.
Unique Military Unit 1 :: Legio Lineata (Age 4)
- Heavy Spearman, but with swift speed.
Unique Military Unit 2 :: Meddix Tuticus (Age 4)
- Heavy Cavalry. Strong attack.

Hero 1 :: Gaius Pontius
- Defeated the Romans, captured their army, and forced their soldiers to pass beneath a yolk, dealing them a great dishonor. Enemy units within his LOS have 5% less all armor types. When put into formation, that formation has 15% greater movement speed.

Hero 2 :: Gaius Papius
- Samnite hero of the Social War. He had great success against the Romans and captured many cities and towns. He has the ability to convert entire enemy formations to his side. This ability takes so long to recharge that at most it gets used 2 or 3 times in a game.

Wonder :: Tribal Tomb
- A lavishly painted tomb. Decreases enemy attack strength 7% while it survives.

Unique Building Economic/Civic :: Resource Depot
- Combines both the Storehouse and Granary into one structure. Consequently, also has the combined HPs of the two.
Unique Building Military :: Mercenary Camp
- Sell a unit at this structure to gain its cost in gold for your tribe. What the unit costs total (wood, food, stone, gold, etc.) the player will gain back in gold. You are essentially hiring out your soliders with this ability. This also decreases the cost of mercenaries for enemy players by 1% for each use.

Unique Techs:
Unique Tech 1 :: Oath Takers (Age 4)
- Decreases train time for all UUs by a great amount.
Unique Tech 2 :: Bronze Belts (Age 3)
- A sign of manhood for the Samnite Warrior. Each foot unit gains +30% HPs.
Unique Tech 3 :: Heroic Imagery (Age 4)
- Greek colonists considered the Samnites to be decendants of the Trojans and Achaeans. Trade with Greeks or Macedonians is bonused +100%.
Unique Tech 4 :: Triple Disc Cuirass (Age 3)
- Hack armor increased +15% for all units.

Advantages
- Easy civ to learn.
- Good Unique Techs and Civ Bonuses.
- Easy econ management. Gold comes relatively easy.
- Has all Javelin and Spear upgrades.

Disadvantages
- Low selection of units.
- Only two heroes. This is the most "basic" of civs.
- Defensive navy only.

[This message has been edited by Mythos_Ruler (edited 07-29-2007 @ 11:57 PM).]

Gato
Skirmisher
(id: GatoFedorento)

posted 07-28-07 06:06 AM EDT (US) 903 / 929

Yay! It's all done!

What about now?...

Long live early music.

[This message has been edited by Gato (edited 07-28-2007 @ 06:07 AM).]

Usac
Skirmisher

posted 07-28-07 01:05 PM EDT (US) 904 / 929

There should probably be one hero. After all, in a map style thats sort of like 'protect the hero' where if your hero dies you lose, you kinda cant win as Samnites. Gaius/Gavius Pontius comes to my mind as a possible hero.

Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 07-28-07 06:22 PM EDT (US) 905 / 929

Pontius added as their hero. Thanks man!

Gato
Skirmisher
(id: GatoFedorento)

posted 07-29-07 06:37 AM EDT (US) 906 / 929

So, Mythos... What is the next step??

Long live early music.

Wakain
Skirmisher

posted 07-29-07 07:28 AM EDT (US) 907 / 929

@mythos ruler:
but the companions may be Alexanders' mainline cavalry, they also were mostly nobles, so I think they should come at a later age (just like the hetairoi came in age4), I think age 3... podromoi were alexanders' scouts, and therefore should come as first... I still see a big difference between spears and lances, and you don't counter a charging horse with a sword. I think there is a slight difference between attacking a tight phalanx formation and a mounted swordsman and a mounted spearman charging eachother, especially in a time shield weren't used when mounted, as hastati and later on rodelero's had shields to swipe away/block sarissas and pikes so they could get close where the hoplite/phalangite was very vulnerable...

but what about:

greek scout cav. = podromoi
greek spear/lance cav. = hetairoi(companion)
greek sword cav. = those those other guys forgot the name...

btw mythos: I appreciate you large share in creating this modification(I count 6 civilisations), and remember I'm not correcting you, merely giving suggestions you or others might want to use...

@ no one in particular
for how they looked like I'd suggest www.hat.comand then click on ancients...(from alexander the great to the late roman empire/early medieval ages and enemies of all[psersians to visigoths

])

-=Wakain=-

Usac
Skirmisher

posted 07-29-07 06:11 PM EDT (US) 908 / 929

This game is split up by expansions. I'm curious though, if with each new expansion new units or technologies are introduced, or if it's only just civs. After all, Rise of Rome brought significant change to the previous game with the advent of new units for every age beyond the stone age. I'm wondering if expansions will give previous civs any new toys as well, or if its just new civs.

Dieneces
Skirmisher

posted 07-30-07 02:09 AM EDT (US) 909 / 929

Prodomoi were more than just scouts! They should be kept as whatever unit they were before hand. Above all, they were light-armoured heavy cavalry and were the most common of Greek cavalry.

Hyppikons, if those are the sword cavalry you refer to Wakain, didn't really exist to a massive degree. Above all, the spear/lance was the main weapon for Greek/Makedonian infantry and cavalry.

"You cannot discover an inhabited land. Otherwise I could cross the Atlantic and 'discover' England."
- Dekhatkadons, Onondaga Iroquois chief.

Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 07-30-07 05:42 PM EDT (US) 910 / 929

That's another reason right there Dieneces that the Prodromos should have been the mainline Cavalry for the Greeks in AOM: Hyppikons were very rare on the battlefield in Greek warfare, whereas Prodromoi were the main type of cavalry used throughout Greece (and obviously in Thessaly).

I think the next step is for everyone to take the example of the techtree I will upload and try to reconcile their civs into it. Save it. Then send it back to me so I can combine them all into one Excel Spreadsheet. Until that time, I think it'd be cool for everyone to look through all the civ profiles and critique them. What I'll do is combine them all by expansion and repost them in a new thread so we can critique them all together as a group.

Usac
Skirmisher

posted 07-31-07 11:51 PM EDT (US) 911 / 929

Dunno if it's already planned but I think before mounted archery range units can be trained at the archery range, a stable must be built to show that the civ is learning to work with horses. Of course, UU mounted archers could be exempt.

Thor of Fire
Skirmisher

posted 08-01-07 05:06 PM EDT (US) 912 / 929

Could I join the "next step"

"Faith is beliving in something you know doesn't exist"-Mark Twain 98% of the internet population has a myspace if you are part of the two percent that can resist this stupid fad copy and paste this onto your signature, besides facebook just is the best period.
Eso1=Bronco29
Eso2=Bronco28

iLord
Skirmisher
(id: Lord Iarune)

posted 08-01-07 06:58 PM EDT (US) 913 / 929

Here is my edited Indians. I changed them a little bit, so Mythos could you please change the link to this new one? Thanks.

Indians

Bonus 1 - "Royal Lineage": Gold slowly generates from Town Centers.
Bonus 2 - "Ganesha's Animals": Samnahya +25% siege, have slight bonus against infantry.
Bonus 3 - "Caste System": For every two villager units trained, one free military unit is trained at a Town Center.

Villager Citizen/Peasant and Slave: Sudra
Villager Merchant and Colonist: Vaisya

Infantry Militia: Clubman --> Axeman --> Longswordsman
Infantry Spearman: Dirghyudha --> Marajha Guard
Infantry Swordsman: Katar --> Tiger Claws
Ranged Slinger: Aryan Slinger
Ranged Skirmisher: Chakram --> Elite Chakram --> Vishnu Chakram
Ranged Bowman: Maiden Archer
Cavalry Scout: Harappan Scout --> Kosala Scout --> Maurya Scout
Cavalry Spearman: Trishula --> Elite Trishula --> Shiva Trishula
Cavalry Archer: Yavan

Healer Priest: Brahmin
Spy/Assassin/Diplomatic Unit: Rajah

Siege Stone Thrower: Heavy Slinger
Siege Ram: Ram

Ship Fishing: Dirgha
Ship Trading: Sukadhara Dirgha
Ship Light: Unnata
Ship Siege: Vashesha

Unique Military Unit 1: Four-horse Sadi (Heavy chariot)
Unique Military Unit 2: Samnahya (Elite War Elephant, strongest elephant unit in the game)
Unique Civilian Unit: Engineer- The Engineer is trained at the Siege Workshop. Can repair buildings faster than normal civilian units, can build bridges across waterways (one section at a time), and can build siege units on the field. (Build limit 7)

Hero 1 Porus: Samnahya within LOS gain LOS bonus, infantry units have stealth ability while he is alive
Hero 2 Siddartha Gautama: Every 5th unit converted by this hero gains the convert ability
Hero 3 Ashoka: Melee infantry +25% speed, can train Dirghyudha/Marajha Guard in blocks of 5 (Slow recharge time)

Town Center
Government Building
Market
House
Temple
Storehouse
Mining Camp
Granary
Farmland
Livestock Pen
Outpost Tower
Palisade Wall
Palisade Gate
Stone Wall
Stone Wall Tower
Stone Wall Gate
Emissary
Smith
Barracks
Archery Range
Stable
Siege Workshop
Naval Yard
Citadel
Academy

Wonder:

Unique Building Economic: Treasury- Any resource can be dropped off here, and it will be converted to gold.

Unique Tech 1: "Indus Architecture"- Buildings 35% stronger, Citadel garrison doubled
Unique Tech 3: "Vedic Script"- Religious techs worship 50% faster, Brahmin conversion rate doubled
Unique Tech 4: "Kshatriya"- Infantry attack +30%, bonus gained against cavalry and siege
Unique Tech 5: "Payed in Blood"- Tiger Claws +19% attack against heroes and infantry, HP of surrounding units gains when a Tiger Claws kills an enemy

×º°”˜`”°º×ALL HAIL THE UNCLELAND!×º°”˜`”°º×[/ind]\
[ind]Help to reveal the Dumbo Conspiracy to the World!

Usac
Skirmisher

posted 08-01-07 07:37 PM EDT (US) 914 / 929

Why would a longSWORD be a militia unit rather than a swordsman? There is the Adze which is an axe that was common in India.

I'm curious which empire in India this is. Indus Valley, Mauryan? Which? If its not both, maybe they could be split to two civs.

Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 08-02-07 06:37 PM EDT (US) 915 / 929

iLord (Lord_Iarune?): Checked the link.

iLord
Skirmisher
(id: Lord Iarune)

posted 08-02-07 09:09 PM EDT (US) 916 / 929

Yes, I am Lord Iarune.

I thought the name was too long, so when the name changes came up, I grabbed the chance.

×º°”˜`”°º×ALL HAIL THE UNCLELAND!×º°”˜`”°º×[/ind]\
[ind]Help to reveal the Dumbo Conspiracy to the World!

egel
Skirmisher

posted 08-05-07 08:25 PM EDT (US) 917 / 929

Has Gato been banned??? Anyway the Samnites look good Mythos. Have you uploaded the tech tree yet? And btw is it going to be any different from what I have already? (What you sent me a while ago?)

Ceres 629's strategy guides

Vive la mort, vive la guerre, vive le sacre mercenaire.

0 A.D

Mythos_Ruler
Skirmisher

posted 08-05-07 11:26 PM EDT (US) 918 / 929

I dont think any different.

Usac
Skirmisher

posted 08-11-07 01:15 PM EDT (US) 919 / 929

There should really be more boats. There is no transport boat, and like in RoR, a Fire Ship should be available, though not it or catapult ship like it was there.

Thor of Fire
Skirmisher

posted 08-13-07 01:48 PM EDT (US) 920 / 929

How is this gonna continue if mythos is banned?

Dieneces
Skirmisher

posted 08-15-07 01:53 AM EDT (US) 921 / 929

Wait up, why was Mythos banned?

I'm completely out of the loop on these boards nowadays. :|

"You cannot discover an inhabited land. Otherwise I could cross the Atlantic and 'discover' England."
- Dekhatkadons, Onondaga Iroquois chief.

egel
Skirmisher

posted 08-15-07 04:51 AM EDT (US) 922 / 929

Why has he been banned? And Gato's banned as well. wtf!!!!

Ceres 629's strategy guides

Vive la mort, vive la guerre, vive le sacre mercenaire.

0 A.D

Thor of Fire
Skirmisher

posted 08-15-07 07:55 PM EDT (US) 923 / 929

I didn't see why he has been banned in mod announcements

egel
Skirmisher

posted 08-16-07 01:07 AM EDT (US) 924 / 929

He got banned for creating Gaurdian (who has been banned alot despite his skill in the scenario editor) a new account. He assumes they looked at the IP Addresses and put 2 and 2 together.

Gato is banned because: "Well... my nationalism gets me too far sometimes." Whatever that means but I'd guess at off-topic board stuff.

Hopefully they will be unbanned soon.

Ceres 629's strategy guides

Vive la mort, vive la guerre, vive le sacre mercenaire.

0 A.D

Cassador_Chris
Skirmisher

posted 08-24-07 07:35 PM EDT (US) 925 / 929

Hmm. Well, I'm glad the basic civ outline is finally finished. Tell you the truth, for the longest time I thought that this little project had stalled out. Good work everyone.

Egyptians rule.

-CT

Another year!-another deadly blow!
Another mighty Empire overthrown!
And we are left, or shall be left, alone.
-William Wordsworth

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Age of Empires III Heaven » Forums » Future Robot, Bonfire, Windstorm, and NewToy Games Forum » [Group Project] "Age of Antiquity"

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